Forum V: Archive
Compiled: Fri, Apr 28, 2000 at 11:23:22 (GMT)
From: Apr 10, 2000 To: Apr 25, 2000 Page: 4 Of: 5


JW -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:54:33 (GMT)
__ EV-ex -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:13:54 (GMT)
__ __ JW -:- Misty watercolored memories of the way we were -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:19:44 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- So Cecile finally became a saint, eh? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:58:30 (GMT)
__ Stonor -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:07:22 (GMT)
__ __ JW -:- Don't Be Paranoid.... -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:04:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ dv -:- Dennis Murphy -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:11:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Not the same one I know; thanks for details (nt) -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:44:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonor -:- I will try to get in touch with him -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:37:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ JW -:- Look down below in my response to G... (NT) -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:17:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ G -:- There is more than one -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:48:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ JW -:- There is more than one -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:13:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ G -:- There is more than one -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 18:18:00 (GMT)
__ ME -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:45:36 (GMT)
__ __ Pacific Bell Operator -:- Jim, want to call David Smith again? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:07:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ PBO's assistant -:- more phone numbers -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 01:27:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ ME -:- more phone numbers -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:39:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Susan -:- thanks forum administrator -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 19:02:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Hold on for a second. Are these guys 'officials'? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:41:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jean-Michel -:- All those phone # are printed on EV's official -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 16:32:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Then what's the big deal? -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 17:34:33 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Who's this Jenness guy? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:39:10 (GMT)
__ zzz -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:24:23 (GMT)
__ Jerry -:- The Initiators -- where are they now? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:05:18 (GMT)
__ Way -:- Susan Johnson -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:59:52 (GMT)
__ __ JW -:- Is Susan still a 'big girl?' -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:44:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ Stonor -:- Is Susan still a 'large woman?' -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:50:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ JW (A Big Boy) -:- Is Susan still a 'large woman?' -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:53:49 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Sucker! (nt) -:- Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 02:34:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Jim's a boy; JW's a man. -:- Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 14:01:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Susan -:- Is Susan still a 'large woman?' um, yes(ot) -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:19:09 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor's vote -:- 'fluffy' or 'large woman?' -:- Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 13:47:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- HA HA! JW GETS HIT BY THE PC POLICE! (nt) -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:50:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Stonor gets hit by the feminists: Weep for me! -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 21:12:16 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- A few more words on terms of 'endearment' -:- Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 15:58:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- Sweetie, honey, girl, girlfriend.... -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 22:52:32 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Susan -:- Sweetie, honey, girl, girlfriend....(ot) -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:09:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Thanks for going into details . . . -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 14:04:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- We can change the world!! -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:15:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Susan -:- Some things you CAN count on! -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:21:11 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Helen -:- hey gals -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 20:51:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Terms of endearment? -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 18:35:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- And one more thing about 'girls'... -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 23:10:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ Way -:- Re Susan Johnson -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 18:12:23 (GMT)
__ __ Angry -:- Ira -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:36:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ Daneane -:- Ira and Susan Johnson -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:24:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ JW -:- Really? Can You Explain More? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:28:13 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Daneane -:- Really? Can You Explain More? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:55:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ Brandy -:- Ire -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:46:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Angry -:- Brandy, Brandy, Brandy!!! -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 09:59:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ ex cultie Hal -:- cult programming -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:56:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Cognac -:- Contentment :) -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:53:12 (GMT)

Oncle George -:- what has become of Ronnie Davis? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:49:50 (GMT)
__ JW -:- Do you mean RENNIE Davis? (nt) -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:01:12 (GMT)
__ __ Oncle George -:- Do you mean RENNIE Davis? (nt) -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:49:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ JW -:- Hmmm, can't sing OR spell..... -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:36:07 (GMT)

JW -:- Remember the 1978 prediction? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:18:13 (GMT)
__ Jimmy Fitz -:- Brooklyn Bridge For Sale Today! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:05:13 (GMT)
__ EV-ex -:- Remember the 1978 prediction? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:57:00 (GMT)
__ Jim -:- Oui, d'accord, je me souviens! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:25:08 (GMT)

Jim -:- Anyone know how to make MPEG's? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:54:03 (GMT)
__ Daneane -:- Possibly -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:49:59 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Okay .... do you have the film? -- JM? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:03:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ dv -:- I have a semi naked m in mala dancing video. -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 12:41:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Jim -:- Yes! Absolutely. Send it to Deanane -- JM? -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:20:04 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Quality Control -:- DV: make copies before you send anything off (nt) -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:41:52 (GMT)

Jim -:- Where's the party? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:01:10 (GMT)
__ Way -:- Re:Where's the party? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:13:03 (GMT)
__ __ Jim -:- Re:Where's the party? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:10:47 (GMT)
__ __ __ Mudraji -:- Tierra del Whatchamacallit -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:13:20 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ SB -:- Tierra del Whatchamacallit -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 18:21:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ G -:- Mud is Love and Love is Mud, All you need is Mud. -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:55:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- God Made Mud. . . -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:41:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ rotten apple -:- It's as clear as Mud. . . -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 12:09:48 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Katie -:- God Made Mud. . . -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:51:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Ackkkkkkk!!!!! I forgot the website! -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:57:45 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Ackkkkkkk!!!!! I forgot the website! -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:29:56 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Bokonon Bliss is the Best! Loved the excuse (nt) -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 18:49:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ Way -:- Pole shift next month! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 18:44:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- I meant 'break' (nt) -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:14:00 (GMT)

Oliver -:- This and That plus Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:54:29 (GMT)
__ Brandy -:- Corpulence -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:10:27 (GMT)
__ __ Jabba The Hut -:- Corpulence -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:36:06 (GMT)
__ Webbi-Ji -:- This and That plus Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:42:30 (GMT)
__ G -:- Amaroo fundraising -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:32:59 (GMT)
__ Selene -:- This and That plus Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:28:09 (GMT)
__ Way -:- This and That plus Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:13:32 (GMT)
__ Napoleon Solo -:- Wrong -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 13:35:50 (GMT)
__ __ Anarchist -:- Right -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:13:15 (GMT)
__ __ __ Mike -:- Right ON, Anarchist! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:28:49 (GMT)
__ x -:- ThisThat . ForSurely -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:34:58 (GMT)
__ Hal -:- This and That plus Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:10:15 (GMT)
__ __ A.P. -:- Message to Premies -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:01:09 (GMT)

Trixie -:- Message to Premies reading Forum -:- Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 20:05:08 (GMT)
__ bad apple -:- Message in a bottle -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 12:00:19 (GMT)
__ yz -:- Message to Premies reading Forum -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:43:16 (GMT)
__ __ trixie -:- Message to Premies reading Forum -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:18:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ yz -:- Message to Premies reading Forum -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 13:32:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Stonor reader -:- Who you callin' sweetheart? (NT) -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 13:00:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ yz -:- opps thought your were some numb nuts guy -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 16:35:35 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor reader -:- Little touchy aren't ya, -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:03:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ yz -:- shit! I thought I was being clever(nt) -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:11:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ xy -:- Sure, honey bunny(NT) -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:01:42 (GMT)
__ Robbie -:- Why mess around? -:- Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 21:59:58 (GMT)
__ __ x -:- Why ? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 03:46:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ Mike -:- Except simpletons -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:29:46 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ x -:- Except simpletons -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 05:05:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Mike -:- Enjoyment without action -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:28:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Trixie -:- Enjoyment without action -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 06:59:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ trixie -:- Premies Reading - Look carefully at this -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:26:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Robbie -:- Trixie- Look carefully at this -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:55:14 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Mike -:- NOT A TEACHER????? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:04:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ trixie -:- NOT A TEACHER????? Not a Rob???? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:59:21 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- NOT MY TEACHER ANYWAY -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:15:43 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Mike -:- The only thing -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:21:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- I am unaware ot -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:02:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Mike -:- If people want the premie perspective -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:44:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Ataboy! Well said Mike! n t -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 09:47:27 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Max Smart -:- before and after -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:06:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Trixie -:- OH Max! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:30:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- You're a fucking idiot -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:33:41 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- And you are the bright genious, Jim??? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:24:42 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ EV-ex -:- Robbie, at least Jim can spell 'genius'! -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:21:59 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Trixie -:- Jim I am insulted. -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:10:19 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Respect? Just because you're a human being? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:01:08 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- LOL!: Respect? Just because you're a human being? -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:29:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Question: should 'respect' mean anything? -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:52:50 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- No, it isn't -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:09:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- That's meaningless fluff -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:26:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Meaningless fluff to you maybe -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 12:21:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Or another way of saying it is ...... -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:29:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Daneane -:- Respect -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 03:18:37 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ trixie -:- fine hairs -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 12:37:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Really, it's a tricky word, this 'respect' -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:43:38 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ trixie -:- Really, it's a tricky word, this 'respect' Yep -:- Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:47:18 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- tricky word, this 'respect'??? Really? -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 16:15:51 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- a good way to look at 'respect' -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 15:17:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- That's not very helpful, Chris -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 16:25:25 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- Point taken (in some instances) Jim, but: -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 17:04:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- But .......no -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 17:16:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ cq -:- With respect to that respect of 'respect' ... -:- Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:47:07 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Hal -:- Respect / Daneane. -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 09:55:05 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Stonor -:- Nice Hal, very nice. (nt) -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 18:55:31 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- The main difference between us... -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:48:17 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Faith is a weakness, hope is good and love? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:47:02 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ Way -:- To Robbie -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:52:29 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- To Way -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:17:26 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- By the Way -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:53:28 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- You should be blocked -- FA? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:51:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Bjørn -:- Who should be blocked from FA? -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 07:28:39 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Bjorn reader -:- Bjorn,some advice -:- Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 22:03:53 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ Jim -:- Coem on, FA's -- you've got a job to do! -:- Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:17:54 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ trixie -:- Trixie- Look carefully at this -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 10:50:06 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ __ __ Robbie -:- Trixie- Look carefully at this -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:36:36 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jim -:- Look at what the cult is reduced to! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:20:00 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ x -:- Look at what the cult is reduced to! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:21:44 (GMT)
__ __ __ Jean-Michel -:- Why ? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:09:12 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Mike -:- Drinking wine simple? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:40:13 (GMT)
__ __ Daneane -:- Ummm..what was that word? Propagation? -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:03:40 (GMT)
__ __ __ Trixie -:- My experince going back to M, Slightly Sci Fi! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:58:23 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ trixie -:- FA Posting this again- Replys to Rob get deleted.. -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 01:56:01 (GMT)
__ __ __ __ Oliver -:- My experince going back to M, Slightly Sci Fi! -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 01:26:31 (GMT)
__ __ Hal -:- Why mess around? -:- Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 22:31:55 (GMT)
__ __ __ Trixie -:- This is not a popularity contest. -:- Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:18:12 (GMT)
__ Hal -:- Great Trixie, I like your posts. (nt) -:- Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 20:15:36 (GMT)


Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:54:33 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
Any ideas? How many are still premies and how many aren't?

Okay, the first five Western Initiators:

Bill Patterson -- an ex (Mahatma Satchitanand)
Kathy Sullivan -- an ex (Pranam Bai)
Ira Woods -- still a premie, I think (Mahatma Gurupujanand haha)
Arthur Brigham -- an ex (I think) (Mahatma Pompousassanand)
who WAS the 5th?

Others:

Joan Apter -- still a premie
David Smith -- still a premie AND a robot
Candi McNary?
Anne Johnston -- the Lord's Laundress
Rich Neal -- maybe a premie, but still an alien
Randy Prouty -- still a premie
Julian West -- ???
Alan Imbarrato -- an ex and I'm told 'hates' Maharaji
Susan Johnson -- ???
Sally Vanmanen
Sally Reeder
John Hampton
John (the doctor from DC)
Dennis Murphy
F. Attems
Cher

Any others?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:13:54 (GMT)
From: EV-ex
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
JW -

Of the new batch of 22 instructors, 10 are from North America:

Danielle Fitzpatrick
Marci Klein
Stephen Koons
Yvette Korell
Scott Mazo
Judy Ollman
Jackie Reece
Harry Schneider
Sally Vanmanen
Cecile Boisvert (Canada)

Ira Woods is the 'Instructor Contact for North America'.

Some 'golden oldies' (former initiators?) who are still active premies include:

Loring Baker (resides Malibu)
Stuart McDougall (Pacific Northwest Security Contact)
John Miller (resides Florida)
Rich Neel (employed by Visions International)
Eric Reinemer (resides Colorado)

I'm sure some of these names ring some bells.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:19:44 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: EV-ex
Subject: Misty watercolored memories of the way we were
Message:
Yes, the bells are ringing:

Marci Klein -- oh yes. Never an ashramer, lived in San Francisco with her boyfriend in the 80s, they fought a lot. She ran some kind of small telephone reseach company, and she hired premies to do a lot of the phone work.

Harry Schneider: A New York guy who I lived with in the ashram in Chicago. Actually, he was the housefather after I left to go to DECA, and he failed to make a bunch of payments on a car I had bought in my name, ruining my credit for a few years. Thanks, Harry!

Sally Vanmanen -- a very straight-laced young woman from Western Michigan with a Dutch Reformed kind of wholesomness. She went to Wheaton College in Illinois prior to being a premie, and later was sent to Waldorf School in Detroit, so she could teach at Unity School in Denver. She was an initiator in the late 70s, and everyone was surprised Maharaji deigned to pick her because hardly anybody knew who she was. Nice person, really. Sorry to see she is still involved. I lived with her at COLL in San Antonio and then she toured as an intiator a lot in the Midwest, so she was in Chicago quite often.

Scott Mazo -- I remember him as a short, dark-haired guy, I think from New York.

The 'oldies' guys all bring back memories. I wonder how active they actually are.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:58:30 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: EV-ex
Subject: So Cecile finally became a saint, eh?
Message:
I always knew she had it in her.

And Stuart? Nice guy. Probably the most boring satsang in the world but, you know, these days I see that as a plus.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:07:22 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: stonor770@netscape.net
To: JW
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
Dennis Murphy? I know of one and I believe he was originally from the States. I don't want to take part in a 'witch hunt'. Give me more info as to your motivation to know, and I'll decide if I want to give you any more.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:04:36 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Don't Be Paranoid....
Message:
I just wondered if they are still premies or not, and maybe whether they are still active in the cult. I don't care where they live, what their phone number are or anything else.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:11:23 (GMT)
From: dv
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Dennis Murphy
Message:
Last I knew he was in Miami. A year or two ago his sister in a rather serious tone told me he was nuts!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:44:37 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: dv
Subject: Not the same one I know; thanks for details (nt)
Message:
Not the same one I know; thanks for details.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:37:12 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: I will try to get in touch with him
Message:
I will try to get in touch with him. If it's the same Dennis Murphy, he might be interested in letting you know about his current status himself. Have you got any info that might give me a better idea if he's the same person? A remarkable number of coincidences underlying this if he is.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:17:28 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Look down below in my response to G... (NT)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:48:12 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: There is more than one
Message:
There is more than one Dennis Murphy. The one I knew was not an instructor.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 23:13:51 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: G
Subject: There is more than one
Message:
G, I think the one you knew was an instructor (actually at that time they were called 'initiators') in the early 80s. He was blonde, had been Maharaji's chef, his sister and parents were premies, etc. He was an initiator in 1983 when I left.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 18:18:00 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: There is more than one
Message:
I know about that Dennis, there is also another Dennis Murphy. He has dark hair and glasses, I believe he lives in the southeastern US and works with computers.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:45:36 (GMT)
From: ME
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
David Smith in an Instructor to date and living in Burbank

Susan Johnson Is still an instructor looks like Santa Monica

And while I'm at it: Linda Gross Home

The three above phone numbers have been deleted by the Forum Administrator, as it is our policy not to publish personal details such as addresses and phone numbers, without the individuals permission.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:07:26 (GMT)
From: Pacific Bell Operator
Email: None
To: ME
Subject: Jim, want to call David Smith again?
Message:
see above
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 01:27:11 (GMT)
From: PBO's assistant
Email: None
To: Pacific Bell Operator
Subject: more phone numbers
Message:
These names and numbers have been removed by the Forum Administrator, because it is the policy of the Forum not to publish personal details, like addresses and phone numbers without the individuals consent.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:39:19 (GMT)
From: ME
Email: None
To: PBO's assistant
Subject: more phone numbers
Message:
These names and phone numbers have been removed, because it is our policy not to publish personal details such as addresses and phone numbers, without the individuals permission.

Forum Administrator

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 19:02:55 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: ME
Subject: thanks forum administrator
Message:
I think it is a good policy. I certainly would feel very threatened if my phone number were published on the internet without my permission. This is not a holy war.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:41:35 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: Hold on for a second. Are these guys 'officials'?
Message:
If the phone numbers are given out in any official or semi-official way to aspirants and premies then I think they're completely fair game and couldn't imagine an argument for not publishing them here. Really!

So does anyone know?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 16:32:09 (GMT)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: All those phone # are printed on EV's official
Message:
documents circulated among the co-ordinators and active premies.

I own copies of those .......

Maybe I should reproduce them on my EV today page ?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 17:34:33 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: Then what's the big deal?
Message:
JM,

Yes, by all means put them up. They're already public in the premie world. (This is premie hell which is, cosmologically speaking, part of it also.)

By the way, what do you think of Deanane doing some video clips for your site? You'd put them up, wouldn't you? I think they'd be super cool. Several reasons.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:39:10 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: PBO's assistant
Subject: Who's this Jenness guy?
Message:
I notice he's a Vancouver lad. Never heard of him. Has he realized Knowledge?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:24:23 (GMT)
From: zzz
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
Ira Woods is in the DC area, a premie a few months ago, probably still, works for Deltek.

John Horton (Dr. John) is the doctor that used to be in DC, I heard he's a doctor again.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:05:18 (GMT)
From: Jerry
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: The Initiators -- where are they now?
Message:
John Horton. My initiator, to be exact. I don't know where he is, or what he's doing today. I just remember asking him, 'What happenned to the light brighter than ten thousand suns?', after he showed us the 'light' technique. He said, 'Give it a week or two'. Funny guy.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:59:52 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Susan Johnson
Message:
Susan Johnson, living in Dallas I believe, still an instructor in 1996.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:44:00 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Is Susan still a 'big girl?'
Message:
I liked Susan. She was unlike a lot of the other DLM/EV honchos in that she came from the working class. I think her parents were farmers.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:50:31 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Is Susan still a 'large woman?'
Message:
What's the point? I guess you're checking your visual memory to make sure that she's the same person. But at least change the 'girl.'

How old was she when you last saw her? (Are you baiting me? ;-)

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:53:49 (GMT)
From: JW (A Big Boy)
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Is Susan still a 'large woman?'
Message:
Okay, I accept the correction, and as a 'big boy,' I am able to do that.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 02:34:41 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: JW (A Big Boy)
Subject: Sucker! (nt)
Message:
hm ....:)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 14:01:29 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Jim's a boy; JW's a man.
Message:
Couldn't resist, Lollipop!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:19:09 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Is Susan still a 'large woman?' um, yes(ot)
Message:
Oh god.... now everyone knows....

Actually I have become too large of late. I have never been larger.

But, I thought you might be interested in that again, in my job, we have to speak of the weight of women we care for. This is hard without sounding cruel. What a touchy issue. I have never quite been able to bring myself to use this expression but many nurses substitute 'fluffy' for fat. It just sounds nicer. As in 'we can't get a good tracing on the baby because the mom is so fluffy'.

Stonor, Katie, what do you think about that?

I have a hard time with the word because it is so non clinical I would be more prone to say something like ' we can't get a good tracing because she has a thick layer of adipose tissue'

That sounds sort of tortured too, huh?

Susan the fluffy. :( and none too happy about it.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 13:47:53 (GMT)
From: Stonor's vote
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: 'fluffy' or 'large woman?'
Message:
I have been called 'fluffy' for my hair. Don't like the term much in any context other than cooking, laundry, feathers and clouds. 'Fluffy' can also mean a woman who is 'cutely' superficial, and overly 'cute' or decorative clothing etc. I'd go with 'solid' or 'large.' Why would anyone prefer 'fluffy' to 'large?'
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:50:28 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: HA HA! JW GETS HIT BY THE PC POLICE! (nt)
Message:
hhhh
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 21:12:16 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Stonor gets hit by the feminists: Weep for me!
Message:
Look at what I have to put up with from my 'feminist' friends!

I received this e-mail last Wednesday. Read it and weep for me Jim, I'm not politically correct with anyone!

(It's a bit schizophrenic though, don't you think?)


TO MY DEAR WOMEN FRIENDS! Thank you for being in my life!

ALL I NEED TO KNOW ABOUT LIFE I LEARNED FROM MY GIRLFRIENDS
* Good times are even better when they're shared.
* A good long talk can cure almost anything.
* Everyone needs someone with whom to share their secrets.
* Listening is just as important as talking.
* An understanding friend is better than a therapist; and
cheaper too!
* Laughter makes the world a happier place.
* Friends are like wine; they get better with age.
* Sometimes you just need a shoulder to cry on.
* Great minds think alike, especially when they are female!
* When it comes to 'bonding,' females do it better.
* YOU ARE NEVER TOO OLD FOR SLUMBER PARTIES!!!
* Girls just want to have fun.
* It's important to make time to do 'girl things.'

* Calories don't count when you are having lunch (or any other
food) with your girlfriends.
* You can never have too many shoes.
* GEMS MAY BE PRECIOUS, BUT FRIENDSHIP IS PRICELESS!!!!!

PLEASE PASS THIS MESSAGE ON TO ALL OF YOUR WOMEN FRIENDS!


I can't stand it anymore! I pass it on to all of you! And I hope it dies a quick death!

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 19, 2000 at 15:58:35 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: A few more words on terms of 'endearment'
Message:
I can only tolerate 'terms of endearment' in a few contexts, primarily with elderly people or when joking. This is not something new - for most of my life, I have felt that this 'terminology' is generally false, and used to feign affection, not express it. It's also a good way of not bothering to remember 'some girl's' name. When a woman doesn't comply with the 'role,' a term of endearment all too often and easily shifts to 'bitch,' and this applies not only to men, but to some women as well.

Calling someone by their name is a form of showing respect, and over the years I've always learned and used the preferred names (and pronunciations) of all my students (and won't accept anything but my first name from them). I've found it instrumental in creating a productive classroom atmosphere and a feeling of community. Looking someone in the eyes is, for me, another way of showing respect.

As for others' personal preferences, clearly I have no control, nor would I want to. I believe in speaking up about 'terms of endearment' and the usage of 'girl' though, as it does stem from the general and long standing classification of women as children, incapable of making intelligent decisions for themselves or as of necessity being under the control/possession of father or husband. 'Boy' is equally patronizing/condescending when used for a man, showing ownership and/or dominance. As for 'girl power,' I'm not crazy about the ways I've heard some girls use it - sounds too much like another potential 'power' trip - somewhat like fighting fire with fire.

In my personal life it is generally quite simple; people who don't 'respect' me remain at an arm's length at best. Those whom I have lost any respect for, I usually ignore.

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 22:52:32 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Sweetie, honey, girl, girlfriend....
Message:
Hi Stonor -
I've been meaning to bring this up for a while...

My secretary (an older woman who I respect and like) calls me 'sweetie'.
Half the waitresses in town call me 'honey' (I live in the southern US - they call Brian 'honey' most of the time, too.).
My female friends and my gay male friends call me 'girl' or 'girlfriend'.

The point is that I can accept and even like being called all these things by other women (or by gay men - it does make a difference). I HATE being called any of these things by straight men, except for my partner, family members, or very close friends. Most straight men use these terms to be condescending, or to establish a hierarchy - other women and close male friends generally use them as terms of affection or sisterhood. THAT is why it doesn't bother me.

BTW, JW is not sexist at all - he is the person who was most supportive of me - including pointing out sexism that I didn't even see - when I was the lone ex-premie female on the forum. But he does like people of all sexes to look good :).

Take care, Stonor -
Katie

P.S. 'Oh daddy dear, we're not the fortunate ones;
that's why girls just want to have fun...'

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:09:40 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Sweetie, honey, girl, girlfriend....(ot)
Message:
This is one of my hot spots too....

But I actually cannot stand sweetie or honey from other women. Not unless there is an edge of a joke to it, like with the use of 'girlfriend' said with that wonderful african american intonation. That is I think a nice expression.

I got into I real live verbal fight at work when someone called me sweetie one too many times on a bad day. Confronted her and told her to stop it I found it demeaning. Frankly, I think the way some people use sweetie or honey you could substitute the word bitch and the conversation would at least be honest.

Did I get anywhere in the argument? No. But she stopped using the word with me!

In nursing school we were directly told to never use these words with clients ( in school they are never referred to as patients ). I think they were 100% right. I go out of my way to use the word woman over girl. I think it is important that our maturity is honored just like men's.

And if you really want to set me into a fury just refer to me as a gal. GRRRRRR>>>>>>.....

Susan....who wrote a post about hating the PC police. But not on this issue.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 14:04:07 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Katie
Subject: Thanks for going into details . . .
Message:
Hi Katie,

Great post! I agree, it is usually context specific! That's why I was laughing at myself in that post to Jim. I do think that most of the time here at the forum, the exceptions are not the rule.

I never said that JW was sexist(!); I questioned the appropriateness of his use of 'girl' in that context.

And another good point in 'and one more thing about 'girls'.'

Wish I had more time.

Thanks again,

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:15:02 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: We can change the world!!
Message:
Good work, girls!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:21:11 (GMT)
From: Susan
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Some things you CAN count on!
Message:
Thanks Jim. Though I was sure your post would be addressed to us Gals.

I knew you would eye this thread with delight!

You should thank us you know for setting you up.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 20:51:45 (GMT)
From: Helen
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: hey gals
Message:
I have to admit that gals, hon, sweetie, when a woman says it, doesn't bother me. Growing up with black folks, everyone calls everyone stuff like that. When an older man calls me sweetie or honey I just figger he is from a different generation so it would be a waste of time trying to change him. WHen a guy more my age does it it *is* a bit insulting. I personally love the expression 'gals' and with a husband from Baltimore, everyone there calls each other 'hon.'

Yet when someone called me a soccer mom once, I was really insulted. What is a girl to do? I try to lighten up on these things. However if I worked in a hospital setting or lived in the south and was bombarded with it as a hierarchical thing, i would probably puke.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 18:35:51 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Susan
Subject: Terms of endearment?
Message:
Up here in the North-east of England the men have no qualms about calling a women 'man' - seriously!

Why'aye, man ...

(Other times it's 'flower' or even 'pet' - short for petal)

In Scotland 'hen' is a common term of endearment.

In the Midlands 'duck'

South-West 'm'dear'




BTW, what's your preference?





PS you can call me 'my 'handsome' like they do in Devon.

(makes a change from f**k-face)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 23:10:40 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Stonor et al.
Subject: And one more thing about 'girls'...
Message:
I've been really happy to see the pre-adolescent girls I know take PRIDE in being 'girls'. I sent a friend with a young daughter a 'GIRLS RULE' bumper sticker for Xmas, and her daughter insisted that she put it on the back of her car. My sister and her 11-year-old daughter have matching 'Listen to Girls' T-shirts (I wish we'd had those when my sister and I were young!). When I grew up, being called 'girl' was always the prelude to insults or a fight - I hope young girls now don't feel that way.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 18:12:23 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Re Susan Johnson
Message:
JW,

I see that Daneane has had more recent contact with Susan than mine. When I saw her in 1996 she was living in Texas and had matured/aged in a nice way, a bit trimmer. Very smartly dressed. I personally always found her 'unusual' and she once answered a question of mine in a way that I found annoying. I have to admit though that her unsaccharin approach was refreshing. The response she gave to Daneane's question a few posts below is very typical.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:36:56 (GMT)
From: Angry
Email: None
To: JW/Way and all
Subject: Ira
Message:
Ira was and probably still is involved in the cult as of 1996. He also is involved in one of the cult businesses. When last I knew, he was involved in the Sales aspect of Deltek. He was working in San Jose and still attending cult functions.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:24:47 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: Daneaneg@earthlink.net
To: Everyone
Subject: Ira and Susan Johnson
Message:
There was a 'fund-raising' or planning meeting with Ira in Orange County California about 6 months ago or so.

Susan Johnson did the mass aspirant meeting for the Southern California area a couple months ago at some hotel in Marina del Rey. There was a video with three young people talking about what a keen guy M is. Susan Johnson went up to talk after it. She had a notebook with her from which she read verbatim some sort of list of things to know before you ask for knowledge...stuff like being free from emotional imbalances, and drug or alcohol problems. I talked to her briefly after. I asked her based on that list, 'So what kind of people you get then?' She said something like 'you'd be amazed...' Like she was used to seeing weirdoes.

When the aspirant contact called to tell me about the 'asking for knowledge' meeting he also read the information verbatim.

That really creeped me out. I did call him the next day though to ask more questions, and he strayed from script. It saddened me though...he was so into it and I; well, I learned of Jean Michel.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:28:13 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Daneane
Subject: Really? Can You Explain More?
Message:
. There was a video with three young people talking about what a keen guy M is.

Really? What was this about? You mean there are actual videos with someone OTHER than Maharaji speaking on it? Was this something new? What did these young people say? Is this an out and out attempt to recruit from the young? Is this a cult?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 17:55:36 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Really? Can You Explain More?
Message:
Yeah, it was more of other people than M I think. I can't remember the name of it, but it was a new video. It was three people talking about there experience. One was a young guy, and American who received knowledge around 18 or so. He said stuff like how things M said weren't right just because M said them, they were right because they were right, and he knew it. He stuttered a lot when trying to express what knowledge was. He said he liked that in M, there were no rules it was all about seeing things for yourself and M just happened to be a really deep guy to talk about such stuff.

The two others were women. One explained how a friend had given her a video and she'd liked it and asked for more. She had a lot of questions and just kept watching the videos. When she asked for knowledge she was still unsure, but still felt there was something there worth the risk and in time her question went away.

They described the day the received knowledge and how afterwards they felt wonder and awe and hoped they were strong enough to practice every day on their own.

Never said the word cult as far as I can remember.

There was some other new videos; one about practice, one about service. In the service one M said something like if you want to help, help. If you don't want to help, don't. In fact, if you don't want to help then please don't help.
Both these videos had a lot of different people talking about their experience...how they set aside time to practice everyday..what it meant to them. Said they did service because they wanted to contribute.

Oddly, these videos, did more to make me wig than win me over. I saw the type of people in that video in relation to the aging small group at the video presenation...not that some weren't cool, but...it seemed very hollywood.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:46:12 (GMT)
From: Brandy
Email: None
To: Angry
Subject: Ire
Message:
Wow! 3 cults in 4 sentences.

Pretty impressive, but, if you work on it, there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to fit at least 2 'cults' into every sentence you write.

Then....look out, Nelson Mandela!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 09:59:14 (GMT)
From: Angry
Email: None
To: Brandy
Subject: Brandy, Brandy, Brandy!!!
Message:
Why do you treat me so? For I am just a poor recovering CULT member, who had many years of life stolen from him because he believed Fatso Ji the Cult leader could show him God. Why?..because the cult leader said so!!

Happy Culting

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:56:42 (GMT)
From: ex cultie Hal
Email: None
To: Brandy
Subject: cult programming
Message:
About cults brandy,

Cults brainwash us into thinking we are not in a cult. Yes there are cults but we are not cult members. Cults are evil cultish things led by derranged cult leaders. Maharaji is sane not derranged like other cult leaders. Being obsessed with Ferraris, rolexes and total control over thousands of cult members is not derranged cult leader behaviour. I am not in a cult. Say it again, I am not a cult member. One more time just to make sure ;not a cult.

Hope I didn't use the word cult too much there! Ooops!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:53:12 (GMT)
From: Cognac
Email: None
To: Brandy
Subject: Contentment :)
Message:
That 'cult' word is really stickin in your craw, isn't it now! :)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:49:50 (GMT)
From: Oncle George
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: what has become of Ronnie Davis?
Message:
Anyone knows?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:01:12 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Oncle George
Subject: Do you mean RENNIE Davis? (nt)
Message:
(nt)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:49:59 (GMT)
From: Oncle George
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Do you mean RENNIE Davis? (nt)
Message:
Whatever.

You say 'Rennie', I say 'Ronnie'.
Let's call the whole thing off.
But Oh.
If we call the whole thing off then we may have to part
and Oh.
If we part, then it may break my heart.
So let's call the calling-off off.

Rennie, oh Rennie. What has become of Rennie the red-nosed raincheck? He must be 120 years old now.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:36:07 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Oncle George
Subject: Hmmm, can't sing OR spell.....
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:18:13 (GMT)
From: JW
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Remember the 1978 prediction?
Message:
Does anyone else recall when Maharaji purportedly said (as broadcast by a variety of those neurotic 'initiators') that any premie who made it with him through 1978 would be with him forever?

Actually, the story was that, during this 'super-devotional period' I think John Miller was talking with Maharaji about how 'full of mind' the year 1976 had been. Maharaji responded something to the effect of 'if you think 1976 was bad, wait until you see 1978!!' and 'any premie who makes it with me through 1978, will be with me forever.' Does anyone else recall this? I remember it was something I heard repeatedly.

In retrospect, I wonder if this kind of thing is similar to the 'big event' kind of thing that keeps premies attached to him.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:05:13 (GMT)
From: Jimmy Fitz
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Brooklyn Bridge For Sale Today!
Message:
I do not recall such an event, but I'm sure that it might have happened and it's embarrassing as hell to believe that I was so entirely lame to base important life decisions on the basis of rumors and promises espoused by P.T. Barnum and his clowns.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:57:00 (GMT)
From: EV-ex
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Remember the 1978 prediction?
Message:
JW -
You just reminded me of something. I made two attempts to leave the ashram (before I finally DID escape) and both times was sat down by the Community Coordinator and told 'You can't go now; something INCREDIBLE is about to happen. I can't tell you what it is yet, but Maharaji is about to do something amazing!'

Well, at the time, I bought it.

Still waiting for something amazing, though.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 19:25:08 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: JW
Subject: Oui, d'accord, je me souviens!
Message:
I remember that Joe. Boy are you ever good at living in the past!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:54:03 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Anyone know how to make MPEG's?
Message:
From time to time someone's tossed around the idea of posting a few clips from LOTU on one of these ex sites. I bet Roger would post them if Brian or JM didn't want to. (Actually, maybe JM's site would be best -- part of 'The Way we Were'). Anyway, there are some new people here, maybe someone with the know-how and interest in doing this. I can't help but think it would be tres cool to have a couple of movies of scenes such as Maharaji dissembling nervously and petulantly at his press conference, or dancing as Krisna, the Holy Family making similar fools fo themselves and then, of course, us doing the same.

Anyone?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 02:49:59 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: Daneaneg@earthlink.net
To: Jim
Subject: Possibly
Message:
I believe I have the technology.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:03:36 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Daneane
Subject: Okay .... do you have the film? -- JM?
Message:
Daneane,

Have you even seen the video yet? Where are you anyway? I've got a copy and a few more are circulating. I'd send you mine but it might be easier to get one from the states if that's where you are. It just takes forever for parcels to cross the border, I'm afraid.

Email me, if you like: heller@bc1.com (best to cc abrala@home.com too)

And JM, would you put the clips on your site if Daneane made them?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 12:41:04 (GMT)
From: dv
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: I have a semi naked m in mala dancing video.
Message:
I'll have to dig it out of storage. I also have the whole set of 12 or so audio cassettes of the hanjayanti 78 or 79 ( I forget which one) program in Kissimmee. Let me know if you're interested.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:20:04 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: dv
Subject: Yes! Absolutely. Send it to Deanane -- JM?
Message:
This should be fun. A couple of video clips from LOTU and videos like yours could be a lot of fun. If Deanane makes video clips, JM, would you put them up?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:41:52 (GMT)
From: Quality Control
Email: None
To: DV
Subject: DV: make copies before you send anything off (nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:01:10 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: Where's the party?
Message:
You know, usually it's an amazing event when the Speaker of the Universe has a Satellite Event and talks about stuff and everything. Premies get all excited weeks in advance (Q: How can you tell when premies are excited? A: They start counting each other and sending in the numbers.). There's a flourish of activity as everyone settles into that place for a little clarity and understanding. Maharaji comes with great fanfare and does what he does best. Then everyone swoons and drools over on ELK and Visions posts a nutshell of the Speaker's Discourse.

But this time nothing. Whaddup?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:13:03 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Re:Where's the party?
Message:
Well, the latest Satellite Event has not yet been aired in Europe, so it would be premature to offer free highlights on the Internet - might cause a drop in paid attendance over there this weekend. Or maybe, the numbers in the US were so dismal that even premies can't figure out how to inflate them this time. Or maybe most people's reactions were like the one that Anonymous mentioned below. Or maybe they don't want exes to read all about it anymore. Who knows?

Do you have any quesses about what M's latest secret project is? Usually, when the guru's trip starts to head toward a 'dire situation,' (i.e. the faithful are escaping), the guru will come up with some outlandish scheme to strengthen the devotees dependence on his grease. This usually takes the form of some apocalyptic prediction that inspires great fear and obedience in the faithful. I think premies in general are a little too savvy for such a tactic, (although Robbie and x and yz would probably fall for it).

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:10:47 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: Re:Where's the party?
Message:
I think Maharaji's got a unique problem vis-a-vis other cult leaders in that his following doesn't live in insular enclaves but work in the world and carry the cult in their heads. That really limits any apocalyptic fear-mongering he might otherwise indulge in. Back when Millenium happened most of us already lived together, if not in ashrams, in harcore premie houses. But the plan was to concentrate the troops even further via compounds like C.O.L.L., the City of Love and Light in San Antonio. Cut off information flow, stoke the wild fires and see where it goes?

Unfortunately for him, Maharaji must have believed in himself a bit too much pre-Millenium. Like John and Patsy Ramsey, he offered the world a test. They say they'll take a lie detector, he said a 'strange and wonderful thing will happen'. If they take the test, they'll fail (unless there's some elaborate lie-detector training available). He took the test (i.e. Can you or can you not inaugurate a 'thousand years of peace'?) and he failed.

So then things dissipated and Maharaji never really brought us bakc together again like he'd have to in order to ratchet up the real weird shit some cult leaders resort to. Sure, he talked about us all getting some land together somewhere. Remember his satsangs at Kissimmee where he teased us with his dystopian vision? We'd all be living on 'the land' somewhere and Raja Ji would drive around in his jeep rounding up satsang delayers. Shades of the Eli, the brainwashed, gentle surface creatures in H.G. Wells' The Time Machine.

But it never happened. Maharaji must have been too happy fucking his wife (or whoever) and playing with his toys to gofor the kill. You know, it's like he set us up perfectly in '77 with all those 'Nineteen day programs', 'festivals' set 19 days apart, one after another, to test our allegiance and brake our growing grip on the world (i.e. jobs, security). A lot of us got giddy with the sense that, after the 'lessons' we'd learnt in the 'experimental independence' or 'confusion', of '76, Maharaji was bringing us together, more than ever and for once and for all, into 'Maharaji's World'. He could have gotten us to do anything then. All he did do, though, was lay one heavy, mind-numbing guilt trip after another on us.

So, years later, he finally does get some land at Amaroo and Tierra del Whatchamacallit but it's all meaningless by then. Not enough cult tension to go for the kill. Maharaji doesn't really know what to do with the land so he has a few programs, opens a farcical premie restaurant there and that's about it. The cult has mushed into pulp fiction.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:13:20 (GMT)
From: Mudraji
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Tierra del Whatchamacallit
Message:
Tierra del Whatchamacallit? Listen, monmot, after all the love and grace I gave you and you know like you you show this DISRESPECT! It's La Tierra del L'Amour. And you know, L'Amour means 'that Love' in case you don't know.

It's come to My attention that someone here at this dark 'Forum', a premie who THINKS he's an 'ex-premie', called it 'La Tierra del l'Mud', and wrote this as if it's a negative thing. That shows just such a lack of that understanding, that clarity that we all need in our lives. Don't know you, I actually stepped on that land. Don't you see, I blessed all the water in all that mud, turning it all to Holy Water, making all that beautiful mud into a vessel for that charnamrit. By trudging through that Mud, you were infused with the Holy Vibration that I imparted to the water in that Mud. With each step, a year was taken off from your wheel of rebirth, a year of Karma gone. That's why I made the hike to the bus so long, to increase My Blessings to you. You should be expressing gratitude, singing My praises, and all you do is complain. For that, you must sing 10 Artis to Me.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 18:21:37 (GMT)
From: SB
Email: None
To: Mudraji
Subject: Tierra del Whatchamacallit
Message:
Tierra del Amor means Land of Love...

s

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 22:55:08 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: SB
Subject: Mud is Love and Love is Mud, All you need is Mud.
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:41:53 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G
Subject: God Made Mud. . .
Message:
You wrote:

Mud is Love and Love is Mud, All you need is Mud.

The Last Rites of the Bokononist faith (each line is said once by the person giving the rites, and repeated by the dying
person):

God made mud.
God got lonesome.
So God said to some of the mud, 'Sit up!'
'See all I've made,' said God, 'the hills, the sea, the sky, the stars.'
And I was some of the mud that got to sit up and look around.
Lucky me, lucky mud.
I, mud, sat up and saw what a nice job God had done.
Nice going, God.
Nobody but you could have done it, God! I certainly couldn't have.
I feel very unimportant compared to You.
The only way I can feel the least bit important is to think of all the mud that didn't even get to sit up and look around.
I got so much, and most mud got so little.
Thank you for the honor!
Now mud lies down again and goes to sleep.
What memories for mud to have!
What interesting other kinds of sitting-up mud I met!
I loved everything I saw!
Good night.
I will go to heaven now.
I can hardly wait . . .
To find out for certain what my wampeter was . . .
And who was in my karass . . .
And all the good things out karass did for you.
Amen.

Amen/Om

Stonor, to become mud in a future incarnation.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 12:09:48 (GMT)
From: rotten apple
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: It's as clear as Mud. . .
Message:
maharahaha
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:51:54 (GMT)
From: Katie
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: God Made Mud. . .
Message:
My favorite prayer - thanks for posting. Isn't that from the canon of 'The Church of God the Totally Indifferent'?
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:57:45 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: G and anyone else
Subject: Ackkkkkkk!!!!! I forgot the website!
Message:
here it is:

VONNEGUT

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:29:56 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Ackkkkkkk!!!!! I forgot the website!
Message:
some good stuff there, Stonor:



QUOTE:


The Books of Bokonon advises us:

Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds
himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are
ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way.




A poem from The Books of Bokonon:

Tiger got to hunt,
Bird got to fly;
Man got to sit and wonder, 'Why, why, why?'
Tiger got to sleep,
Bird got to land,
Man got to tell himself he understand.





In the beginning, God created the earth, and he looked upon it in His cosmic
loneliness.

And God said, 'Let Us make living creatures out of mud, so the mud can see what We have done.'

And God created every living creature that now moveth, and one was man.

Mud as man alone could speak.

God leaned close as mud as man sat up, looked
around, and spoke.

Man blinked. 'What is the purpose of all this?' he asked politely.

'Everything must have a purpose?' asked God.

'Certainly,' said man.

'Then I leave it to you to think of one for all this,' said God.

And He went away.




The Hundred-and-nineteenth Calypso
'Where's my good old gang done gone?'
I heard a man say.
I whispered in that sad man's ear,
'Your gang's done gone away.'


ENDQUOTE



and talking of mud - doesn't the name 'Adam' mean just that?

GREAT GIFTS

One day God came to Adam to pass on some news. 'I've got
some good news and some bad news', God said. Adam
looked at God and said, 'Well, give me the good news first.'
Smiling, God explained, 'I've got two new organs for you.
One is called a brain. It will allow you to be very intelligent,
create new things, and have intelligent conversations with
Eve... The other organ I have for you is called a penis. It will
allow you to reproduce your new intelligent life form and
populate this planet. Eve will be very happy that you now
have this organ to give her children. 'Adam, very excited,
exclaimed 'These are great gifts you have given to me. What
could possibly be bad news after such great tidings?'. God
looked upon Adam and said with great sorrow, 'The bad news
is that when I created you, I only gave you enough blood to
operate one of these organs at a time'.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 18:49:53 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: Bokonon Bliss is the Best! Loved the excuse (nt)
Message:
Bokonon Bliss is the Best! Loved the excuse (nt)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 18:44:21 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Pole shift next month!
Message:
I heard on the radio today that the molten core of the earth will begin churning on May 5, 2000 (according to some maps and stuff discovered in a pyramid) culminating in a pole shift. For those who don't know what a pole shift entails, it's not that the Earth will actually turn upside-down, it's merely the electromagnetic balance at the poles that will switch. However, such a shift will not go unnoticed. Various calamities will occur around the globe, with the one exception being a small spot of land near Brisbane.

That last sentence is my own addition, but the rest was really on the radio. The book is called 5-5-2000. At least we don't have too long to wait for verification.

I think you're right, Jim, that Rawat has never taken Armegeddon too literally and is not predisposed to doom and gloom, although I do know that I have some premie literature at home where he does indeed predict some of the usual calamities for the Earth. But that was at age 14 and we wouldn't want to bring that up, would we?

I imagine that the project M has been working on recently is fairly innocuous. I'm sure he'd like to destroy the Internet, but he's probably just finetuning the satellite programs or designing a chair of some sort.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:14:00 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: I meant 'break' (nt)
Message:
jj
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:54:29 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Everyone
Subject: This and That plus Premies
Message:
Before I go into hibernation for the approaching winter downunder, I would like to say how much I have enjoyed the quality of the posts over the past few weeks. Flaming seems to have been reduced and the information coming from the Michael Dettmers posts, and responses to them, are excellent and something I’d love to see more of.

One thing that concerns me is the them and us attitude that seems to exist between ex-premies, and premies who are still under the fat mans spell. I think it should be remembered that we were all in that place once and they should be regarded with compassion rather than disdain. Fair enough, if one of them is silly enough to post some crazy fat man inspired rubbish let’s get stuck right into them but not with barbs of hatred. What good does that do anyone, especially those people who arrive here to use the forum as a tool to find out something about the fat man and his cult.

For what it is worth, I have a very close friend who is still an ardent follower of fatty and we have managed to keep our friendship intact since I confessed that I was a backslider and had long given up practicing. It hasn’t changed the way we relate to each other and nor should it.

On another subject, it seems that the development of Amaroo is on hold with previous management being told to take a walk and new personnel are currently being recruited. It seems money is tight which has delayed fat mans building plans as last years worldwide plea for dollars for Amaroo only raised around $100,000. I don’t know whether this was Aus or US. Is Amaroo going to become known as the fat mans biggest white elephant. Me thinks so.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:10:27 (GMT)
From: Brandy
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: Corpulence
Message:
'One thing that concerns me is the them and us attitude that seems to exist between ex-premies, and premies who are still under the fat mans spell. Fair enough, if one of them is silly enough to post some crazy fat man inspired rubbish let’s get stuck right into them but not with barbs of hatred. What good does that do anyone, especially those people who arrive here to use the forum as a tool to find out something about the fat man and his cult.

For what it is worth, I have a very close friend who is still an ardent follower of fatty. ...fat mans building plans...fat mans biggest white elephant.'

Jeez Oliver, you're really giving Angry a run for the money with this compassionate, incisive and beautifully wrought essay.

Let's see...you managed to include no fewer than 6 uses of 'fat' and it's variations in your eye-opening prose. Bravo!

However, it took you 4 paragraphs to reach your total of 6 'fattys' and Angry inserted 3 'cults' in only 4 sentences. So, for now, we'll have to give Angry the nod, albeit temporarily.

Next time, edit, edit, edit and I believe you'll be more than capable of stuffing more 'fattys' into your remarkable text.

Good luck!

P.S. Wasn't 'Ardent Follower of Fatty' a song by the Kinks?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:36:06 (GMT)
From: Jabba The Hut
Email: None
To: Brandy
Subject: Corpulence
Message:
Brandy:

You wouldn't happen to have OCD, would you? That's obsessive-compulsive disoder in case you don't know. You kind of have a thing for counting words in sentences, ya know? Or perhaps you're just an accountant stuck in drive.

Jabba The Hut
Who is Truly Monmot
A Fat Fuck Who Was Formerly in the Cult (that's one 'fat' and one 'cult'--just to save you the effort)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:42:30 (GMT)
From: Webbi-Ji
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: This and That plus Premies
Message:
Are you a genuine Aussie. You mean they really exist. Please send me you phony-email address at my phony-email address:

montreal.quebec@usa.net

If you have time that is. I'd like to share pictures with someone around the globe. Is it true bath drain flows the opposite side over there?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:32:59 (GMT)
From: G
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: Amaroo fundraising
Message:
A few months ago I heard an announcement that
1) $450,000 had been raised
2) but that there would not be a program at Amaroo this year as was planned (supposedly) because it was not 'ready'.
3) that the program was delayed until 2001.

The person making the announcement was obviously embarrassed.

I wondered about the $450,000 figure. I wonder more now since you mentioned $100,000.

Funny how programs happened at Amaroo several years ago, even though it was far less 'ready' than it is now, and it's still not 'ready'. I've also wondered why the emphasis on this place in Australia, I don't think many premies live in Australia. It seems irrational to have premies travel half way around the world to see him. He just doesn't care about premies' finances.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 17:28:09 (GMT)
From: Selene
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: This and That plus Premies
Message:
Winter sounds wonderful as I prepare to be baked by the unbearable unsheltering sky. 5 months+ of hell.
Told the management to take a hike. It's so bizaree they can't see something odd there. How can maharaji be offering a gift that makes life better, gives a person inner peace...etc and yet.
Why go on with this. It's too obvious.

Oliver if you are saying bye for now I just wanted to say goodbye back at you. Thanks for putting up with me long enough to get through to talk to one of my better sides.
Love, Selene

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:13:32 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: This and That plus Premies
Message:
Oliver,

You say that your premie friend knows you are a backslidder who has long given up practicing. There's lots of that type of former premie and a current premie can always think compassionant, indulgent thoughts about you and forgive your weakness. But has a discussion happened between you and your friend where you refer to Maharaji as 'fat man'? Or do you tiptoe around your true feelings and opinions?

You say that your relationship hasn't really changed, and I'm just wondering if you really mean it. Personally, I still have premie friends who I talk to on a regular basis. But if they knew I was 'Way' and all the things that 'Way' has said on this list, I don't think they would have much interest in getting together for a little visit over lentil soup any longer. I'm much more polite with premies who I know than I am with the ones I communicate with here!

p.s. thanks for the news item about Amaroo.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 13:35:50 (GMT)
From: Napoleon Solo
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: Wrong
Message:
Sorry Oliver, you are wrong. Wait and see
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:13:15 (GMT)
From: Anarchist
Email: None
To: Napoleon Solo
Subject: Right
Message:

'Wait and see'

Ha! That's a good one. I've heard that one before somewhere. Now was it in 1972/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 and 1980/1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 and 1990/1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9? Oh yes it was!

Most people give up waiting after a few years, perhaps a decade. If he's kept you waiting until now and for what? Just a little bit longer and what will it be? Years spent wasted and an emotional dependence upon a little Indian man who cares not a jot about you or even knows that you exist. A little Indian man who has already severed all of his ties with his devotees.

When was the last time he came to your country to give you darshan or inspire you? Hang about; weren't we supposed to long for Maharaji's darshan and weep for it? Don't wait too much longer because this is the end game of the guru.

Patience is a virtue, mind you. You've got that to be thankful for.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:28:49 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: Anarchist
Subject: Right ON, Anarchist!
Message:
A: Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait!

Oh..... a new phase is right around the corner....wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait!

Shit, if there is one thing we had as premies, it was patience... just a little bit longer.... wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait,wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait!

Ok, I DON'T have infinite patience, fat boy, what's it to ya?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:34:58 (GMT)
From: x
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: ThisThat . ForSurely
Message:
>One thing that concerns me is the them and us attitude that seems to exist between ex-premies, and premies who are still under the fat mans spell.

O . live . R

you are ignorant . you have meant it .
yes you are US . the concern is dim .
your agenda intact . that is your desire .
can you see . its a parody .
... jam on to the thing . you know

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:10:15 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Oliver
Subject: This and That plus Premies
Message:
Hi Oliver down under,

I made a similar post to yours a while back re civilised approach to premies. My basis was that I was also one until recently . I also have good friends who are still premies and they're very open to discussion in an intelligent manner. I did find some of the responses to my posts as a premie rather patronising , yet having said that they were all valuable in shaking my complacency. Sometimes I think premies are helped by a loud and somewhat rude, WAKE UP call too.

We're in springtime in the Northern hemisphere so surely it's us who should be decreasing our posts! I like your input here and as Way said to me, the more diversity on the forum the better.

G'day mate. Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:01:09 (GMT)
From: A.P.
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Message to Premies
Message:
I too have a lot of premie friends. And oddly enough they never mention Maharaji. They say things like: Oh thats 'joe' he has knowledge, or You should consider receiving knowledge, or Receiving knowledge was one of the best things I ever did. It almost sounds mysterious, peaking curiosity. Why wouldn't a person be lured to a video presentation? When a friend tells you it's a great thing there is a matter of trust involved. So you go see a video thinking 'joe says it's cool' Don't know what it is but I'll try it again. In fact it seems none of the aspirants actually know what knowledge is because it is a big secret. I've always thought that if 'joe' thought this knowledge was so great, why not just show you the techniques? I mean isn't that what it's all about? Spreading the word. 'Joe' heard Maharaji say on many occasions that knowledge would bring peace etc. etc. etc. So why doesn't he share the techniques with the people he cares about. Doesn't that sound odd to Joe? Maharaji specifically tells him not to share the techniques with anyone else? As an aspirant this would be my first clue that M is a moron. When my mother thought I needed an avenue that would help me escape and relax a little bit she showed me how she meditates. I've since reformed what I learned from her and now I do what works for me. All you premies out there need to think about what Guru Maharichy did for you. HE SHOWED YOU HOW TO MEDITATE THATS ALL. You all owe him nothing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do something for your self and walk away from this losers grasp. Read the information it's all here on these web sites. I mean WAKE UP. What will happen when M is not around anymore? he will die someday you know. And then will you still be able to mediate? YES. Next time you head out to a program to hear the little fat liar speak think about this. KNOWLEDGE IS MEDITATION THAT ALL.
And to all of the exes out there reading this post. Good for you. I'm glad to see you voicing you opinions. Thanks so much for all the info!!!!
PS- The name is not Anitpremie. it's Antiprem.
See Ya
A.P.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 20:05:08 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Premies
Subject: Message to Premies reading Forum
Message:
To all you premies out there- GET HELP. You are living in virtual wanna be bliss. It is not real. Spiritual developement can be yours without dependance on this charismatic rich guy. You will not 'get there' spliced into this guys' gravy trian. Givng up your soul to this guy is a weak thing to do. NOT a surrendering thing to do.

Go to an AA meeting and evertime they say 'drink'- you insert 'Maraji or 'staying in touch'

Check out the possibility that you are in a deep seeded Co- dependant relationship disguised as a spirital path.

If you research this, you may see some correlation between how Maharaji works and the slow erosion of your individual power and you abilty to process emotions in an adult manner.

This is not put here as an invitation to dialogue with you.
You need professional help.

This is the year 2000. The effects of the cult are well known now. No need to exist in with this 1970 Crutch.
Most self help systems these days recognise this.

It is not so hard to quit. AND there is alot of support while you detox-here on the Forum. It can be alot of fun in fact- if you keep a sinse of humor about yourself.
A good thing is to keep reading and not post with pro Maraji content.

Dont let the rough ways on the Forum scare you off. Many of the exs that post here are dealing with various stages if detox.This can range from embarrassment- to anger- to hostility- to a sense of lost years- to grief.
Be compassionate with yourself and others. And laugh
YOU ARE NOT ALONE

Love
Trixie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 12:00:19 (GMT)
From: bad apple
Email: None
To: Trixie
Subject: Message in a bottle
Message:
spiritual developement?
detox?
bees sting.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:43:16 (GMT)
From: yz
Email: None
To: Trixie
Subject: Message to Premies reading Forum
Message:
Yes

but. From a premie who feels odd watching Maharaji, but still calls himself a premie and likes some of the posters here, even Joey a little. This this pysco-anal know-it-all treatment from posters like mary and you who go out of your way to address premies in general, tends to make me want to tell you to go fuck yourself.

Yes this sarcastic, go ahead analyze this.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:18:50 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: yz
Subject: Message to Premies reading Forum
Message:
Yes but. From a premie who feels odd watching Maharaji, but still
calls himself a premie and likes some of the postershere, even
Joey a little. This this pysco-anal know-it-all treatment from
posters like mary and you who go out of your way to address
premies in general, tends to make me want to tell you to go fuck
yourself.

Yes this sarcastic, go ahead analyze this.

This is where you probably tell yourself that your experience is your own and what other people experience is not your business. Including Marajis lifestyle ect ect.
Premeis IN GENERAL are sharing the responsiblity of what Maraji is doing by remaining involved with the cult.
It doestn take an Einstien to analyse this. It is obvious if you even think about it for one second.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 13:32:12 (GMT)
From: yz
Email: None
To: trixie
Subject: Message to Premies reading Forum
Message:
Sweetheart you can make anything you want your business, no problem here, as for premies in GENERAL being responsible for what Maraji is doing, sure, whatever you say.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 13:00:41 (GMT)
From: Stonor reader
Email: None
To: yz
Subject: Who you callin' sweetheart? (NT)
Message:
Don't be calling anyone sweetheart on this Forum.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 16:35:35 (GMT)
From: yz
Email: None
To: Stonor reader
Subject: opps thought your were some numb nuts guy
Message:
but face it your really trying to instigate something so I can tell you to go fuck yourself.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:03:39 (GMT)
From: Stonor reader
Email: None
To: yz
Subject: Little touchy aren't ya,
Message:
Just having some fun - chill all ready. Talk about startin' somethin', jeez Louise.
Forget it.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:11:27 (GMT)
From: yz
Email: None
To: Stonor reader
Subject: shit! I thought I was being clever(nt)
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:01:42 (GMT)
From: xy
Email: None
To: Stonor reader
Subject: Sure, honey bunny(NT)
Message:
xyz
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 21:59:58 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Trixie
Subject: Why mess around?
Message:
I dislike people who tend to tell others what they should do. Why do you try to manipulate 'premies' into changing their belief and and behaviour?

I know there are some premies that experience peace and happiness. Who know that Knowlegde is working. I am one of them.

Let it be.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 03:46:17 (GMT)
From: x
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Why ?
Message:
>I know there are some premies that experience peace and happiness. Who know that Knowlegde is working. I am one of them.

There certainly are people who have experienced great times from their aquaintance with M.
Simple enjoyment appears to be too simple for some people.
Life really is more of a mystery than we want to believe.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:29:46 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: x
Subject: Except simpletons
Message:
x: You said, '...Simple enjoyment appears to be too simple for some people....'

You don't have it quite right. It should have read, 'Simple enjoyment doesn't appear to satisfy anyone except simpletons.'

Jim is right, below. The 'answer' to life IS NOT simply watching it flow by, as you seem to suggest. Disinterested 'watching' is called APATHY.... something the 'original' DUO/DLM combo DIDN'T support. By M's own words, you guys are trying to balance your lives on the single-leg of a three-legged stool. Satsang, Service and Meditation..... Now, M says your path is complete just by meditating! When is he going to get his lie right? When are you guys, as a WHOLE, going to get off your collective duffs and really DO something? In the next 'phase?' Yeah, right.....where have I heard that one before.

In case you are interested, NO dictionary (or any other book, for that matter) equates love with apathy or apathetic lack of action.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 05:05:37 (GMT)
From: x
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: Except simpletons
Message:
enjoyment is not apathy
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:28:44 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: x
Subject: Enjoyment without action
Message:
x: 'enjoyment,' without action based upon your enjoyment, IS apathy! I actually submit that you folks aren't really enjoying ANYTHING! You are just 'experiencing' apathy..... no passion.... no love.... nothing! I've heard it repeated MANY times by premies that they 'just don't care!' THAT IS APATHY, bud.

'Enjoy' your submersion in apathy. That's all it really is! Get yourself clear of the cult and you'll experience REAL enjoyment.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 06:59:02 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: Enjoyment without action
Message:
I can relate to your frustratoin. Since premies only worry about their own peace and happiness, why do they get so bent when they read this site and know other premies may be affected by what they read here?

They have alot invested in propagation of M seed and this is the reason that they are partially responsible for his greed and brainwashing of innocent people.
'So what M does is not my business' is a lie.

Trixie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 06:26:21 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: premeis
Subject: Premies Reading - Look carefully at this
Message:
'-I know there are some premies that experience peace and happiness. Who know that Knowlegde is working. I am one of
them.'

'There certainly are people who have experienced great times
from their aquaintance with M.
Simple enjoyment appears to be too simple for some people.
Life really is more of a mystery than we want to believe.'

These two quotes are posted by premeis- obviously.
Observe how they infer that ex premeis are not experiencing peace and happiness.

And that Simple enjoyment appears to be too simple for some people - namely anyone not involved with M or the cult.

ISNT that FASCINATING??
This is great, keep it coming premies

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:55:14 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: trixie
Subject: Trixie- Look carefully at this
Message:
Trixie
Some times when I post here, some people are confusing me with some guy/ girl called Rob. Who is he / she? I cant see that he has been posting here lately,

By the way, neither I nor you can judge the experience of other persons. The only fact seems like some ex-premies seems to experinece a lot of anger and hatred in their life if one should analyse their writing. Actually I did some experiments posting here and the result of these experiments was quite scary.

Maharaji is a teacher, his job is to direct people who wants to learn. You are not.

I don't see how anyone can claim to have the thruth about anything. Bottom line we are all searching for happiness and each person is responsible for their own life.

Even if I say that Knowlegde is working for me, I can't tell it is working for you. I have a theory though why it does not seem to work for some people.

What I mean to say, things are not so simple, there are a lot of things we think we know, but we don't really.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 15:04:00 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: NOT A TEACHER?????
Message:
Robbie: You said, '...Maharaji is a teacher, his job is to direct people who wants to learn. You are not.'

How do you know that Trixie isn't a certified teacher? I KNOW that M isn't! He has never attended college nor has he been to any teaching establishment. Your insulting diatribe is typical of the spiritual-ego present in most of your premie-species.

The day you think that no one has anything to teach you except the FRAUD, is the day that your brain is truely dead. Well, I guess THAT day has already past (according to your own words above). HE is not a teacher..... a parrot, maybe, but a teacher???? NOT!

By the way, '...people who WANTS to learn' is incorrect grammar. Don't try to claim that its a typo.... the 'S' key is nowhere near the 'T' key on a keyboard. Maybe your.... ahem.... 'teacher' can help you with this. Verbal and written communication is pretty important to those that want to do propagation, or hadn't you thought of that! Oh, wait a minute.... M doesn't even have an elementary school diploma.... I guess he won't be able to help you with this, either!

BTW, Rob was a spiritually superior individual that came here and 'swore' that he was writing a piece of music that we would ALL hear about within a few weeks..... WELL????? It's been about a year.... Where is it? Where is this piece of music that was going to shake the whole world...... WHAT AN EGO! Just like yours, Robbie!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:59:21 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: NOT A TEACHER????? Not a Rob????
Message:
Hi Mike

I think Robbie is Rob but he is trying to cover this fact by making those corny grammar/typo mistakes.
Like he says, he has posted and tested out the forum with what was it- 'scary outcome' or something like that

He cognates/not like Rob. He is actually pretty smart but his brain is like you say dead. Combine that with trying to be illiterate- well, I find it boring.

My theory dates back to when Rob freaked out and finally revealed that he made it his personal mission to find out if there was any truth to the forum threads about legal action and M.
Around then he got all pallsy wallsy and maneuvered into the topic. Then there was all that false agya thing.

Then lately when one thread talked about press releases, Robbie popped up in a nearby thread, challenging something or someone that was going on in the 'press'thread. At that time he was not playing illiterate and even used the name Rob

This is according to my reccollection- which is not perfect because I have a strong imagination.

What I do know is that this simple premie Robbie is a fake.

Trixie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:15:43 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: NOT MY TEACHER ANYWAY
Message:
Sorry to say, my native language is not English. It would not be so difficult to spot that, I think,

Trixie might be a teacher, but in this thread she starts to behave as a guide or teacher to premies, giving advices none has asked her to do.

It seems to be an assumption there that premies are sheeps unable to think.

By the way, music is not my peice of cake. Actually I am an inventor / businesman. Interesting to see the suspicions about this guy Rob. If it is one year ago he wrote here, seems to me this Rob somehow must have impressed you, since you still remember him.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:21:41 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: The only thing
Message:
Robbie: The only thing that 'impressed' me about Rob was his tremendous spiritual-EGO..... one of the largest I had seen up to then.

You said, '....giving advices none has asked her to do.' Well, what is it that YOU are doing? We don't need premie advice nor was it ever requested, yet here you all are trying to 'save' us poor ex's. Kind of like the pot calling the kettle 'black,' no?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:02:31 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: I am unaware ot
Message:
that I ever posted anything that might be an advice to expremies or that I have been trying to save expremies.

Even if my English is not so good, I understand that this 2 things are just what Trixie tried to do in this thread.

Excuse me, is'nt this a open Forum where it is general to express ones opinion about Maharaji. I have never tried to save expremies, actually a very good friend of mine is an former premie. I never tried to save him. The only reason for me to post here, is because 95 % of those who post here are expremies and it is my belief that there is sound to see things from more than one perspective.

But may be you disagree with that.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:44:01 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: If people want the premie perspective
Message:
R: They can go to the M and ELK sites. This forum is the EX-premie forum. That's OUR perspective..... we ARE ex's.

You'll notice that we CAN'T go to the ELK and M sites and call them liars for all the world to see! You'll notice that there is NO free interchange of ideas and thoughts there. In fact, you'll notice that they don't even allow premies to talk to premies. GET THE PICTURE? THIS site is the other end of the 'balancing stick.' We don't need to be 'balanced' in our view of M, if for no other reason than the M-sponsored sites don't allow 'balanced' communication..... NO DISSENTERS, NONE!

A couple of folks here even posted positive M-based 'stories' to the ELK site. In EVERY case, the posts were significantly altered by ELK premies. If you don't believe this, you can ask to see the site material before and after editing by ELK. It was the most disgusting display of censorship that I've ever seen. So much for the thought that there is ANY balance or freedom of expression on those sites. The way I see it, if a 'premie' wants to SAY that M is god, then they should be allowed to do so without EDITING by those ELK morons. What do you think about that????????

Don't come here and call us 'biased' without FIRST going to the sites that you agree with and fixing THEIR BIASES! Why aren't you premies SCREAMING and those sites for editing? Why aren't you premies SCREAMING at those sites to allow you freedom of expression..... no matter WHAT you say? Why? Answer THAT question!

Personally, I think that premies should consider themselves 'guests' at this forum. They should act accordingly. Since we aren't welcomed as 'guests' at YOUR forums, you ought to consider yourselves lucky that you can come here and say ANYTHING at all!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 09:47:27 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Mike
Subject: Ataboy! Well said Mike! n t
Message:
nt
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:06:26 (GMT)
From: Max Smart
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: before and after
Message:
(from -Why mess around?)
>I dislike people who tend to tell others what they should do. Why do you try to manipulate 'premies' into changing their belief and and behaviour?

(from -I am unaware ot)
>Even if my English is not so good, I understand that this 2 things are just what Trixie tried to do in this thread. Excuse me, is'nt this a open Forum where it is general to express ones opinion about Maharaji. ...and it is my belief that there is sound to see things from more than one perspective.

Why does your speech change so much?
I can't see your point of view if I don't trust you.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 23:30:08 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Max Smart
Subject: OH Max!
Message:
If you would refer to Robbies posts out of the archives, it would show even more speech and vocabulary irregularities.
I would but I have to go get my hair done Max.;)

However, I wouldnt want to see our energy get sidetracked into exposing the fraud. Thats how he works.

I take it as a given. Hes playing Scotch Whiskey mind games.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:33:41 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: You're a fucking idiot
Message:
This kind of stupidity is so typical of premie 'thinking' (well I've got to call it something, don't I?). The combination of superficiality, gross assumptions and pompous so-called 'spiritual' muddle-headedness is just amazing.

Again, I say,

look, what Maharaji has done to these people!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:24:42 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: And you are the bright genious, Jim???
Message:
Actually I am a human being, and would like to be respected as one.

Stupid is, stupid do.

If this is all you can come up with, you don't impress me much.

I have to admit though, sometimes I think, look what the Forum did tho those people.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 03:21:59 (GMT)
From: EV-ex
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Robbie, at least Jim can spell 'genius'!
Message:
which is more than I can say for you!
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:10:19 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Jim I am insulted.
Message:
How COULD you call me THESE PEOPLE.

But you got him to say 'genius'.
Push him till he says 'Mensa' and I'll forgive you.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:01:08 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Respect? Just because you're a human being?
Message:
Robbie,

I respect you just fine. I woudln't want to hurt you, kill you or steal your food. You're a human being and not some animal or worse. I know that.

But, guess what? Human beings have standards, you know? Like that's why we're able to call some things smart, some things so-so and some things stupid. Hell, some things are really smart and some things are really stupid. That's the range, you know. If you're confused this might make it simple. Try cutting this out and studying it:

Really Smart
Smart
So-so Smart
Stupid
Really Stupid

Okay?

Now, it just so happens that everything you've said so far has been Really Stupid. And don't blame me for calling it, bud. If you ever leave Maharaji behind you, too, will look back on your faith as him as idiotic. (Oh sorry, Idiotic is on the Canadian scale. But it's the same as Really Stupid.) So I'm just keeping a little headroom for you to grow into, Robbie. Now if that ain't respect I don't know what is.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:29:37 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Robbie and Jim
Subject: LOL!: Respect? Just because you're a human being?
Message:
LOL!!!

Robbie wrote:

Actually I am a human being, and would like to be respected as one.

That's a really good statement; I think I've said something like that before. But then:

Stupid is, stupid do. If this is all you can come up with, you don't impress me much. I have to admit though, sometimes I think, look what the Forum did tho those people.

Ya ruined it Robbie; that's judgemental and not conducive to intelligent conversation! (ie. stupid - I'm sure you have more potential intelligence that that!)

Stonor

PS. You sucked me into this one Jim, but damn, it was good. I discussed something like this with my Dad. It went along the lines of him saying that all teachers deserve RESPECT, even though he still hates (yes, that was the general thrust - it surprised me too) the one he had until he was 14 - Danish system - about 70 years ago. I disagreed. But I said that all human beings deserve respect.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 00:52:50 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: Question: should 'respect' mean anything?
Message:
An inherent aspect of the meaning of 'respect' is that not all people are alike. Some have greater qualities, this way or that, than others. Thus 'respect'. Admire and honour (i.e. respect) the better qualities and the people that exhibit them, think something less of those who don't. That's life and that's also the only way the word 'respect' means anything.

Okay, so some people talk about how the whole human race deserves respect. I guess that's true in the sense that, as a species, we're pretty cool. We can walk and talk and drive little cars. So, yes, compared to the rest of the animal kingdom, we've got some shared human qualities that are tops. Worthy of respect.

BUT, once you get in closer and deal with people as individuals, assuming the basic set of human qualities as a given and looking at the finer distinctions between peoples' character and actions, it just doesn't make sense to say everyone deserves respect. It's like saying we're all tall. Or smarter than average.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:09:23 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: No, it isn't
Message:
Jim, you wrote:

once you get in closer and deal with people as individuals, assuming the basic set of human qualities as a given and looking at the finer distinctions between peoples' character and actions, it just doesn't make sense to say everyone deserves respect. It's like saying we're all tall. Or smarter than average.

Well, yes and no.What I wrote was an oversimplification, but not. Every human being, every animal and plant and piece of dirt is deserving of respect for the role it plays in a Part of the Whole. There are always appropriate ways of showing respect for each part.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:26:05 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Stonor
Subject: That's meaningless fluff
Message:
Stonor,

I guess you get some comfort from those kinds of sentiments, huh? Oh well, what can I say? I prefer reality myself.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 12:21:23 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Meaningless fluff to you maybe
Message:
For me that 'reality' is hard work, not something I get 'comfort' from.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 01:29:18 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Or another way of saying it is ......
Message:
Well, yes and no.What I wrote was an oversimplification, but not. Every human being, every animal and plant and piece of dirt is deserving of respect for the role it plays in a Part of the Whole. There are always appropriate ways of showing respect for each part.

Yes, Stonor, you're right. I respect dirt for being dirt, animals for beign animals, plants for being plants, cowards for being cowards, liars for being liars, hypocrites for being hypocrites, cult members for being cult members .....

Is that more like it?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 03:18:37 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Respect
Message:
A friend of mine once expressed many people shouldn't deserve to exist. He thought there should be some sort of panel to which people would have to assert their right to exist. But he couldn't ever figure out who should be on that panel.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 12:37:02 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: thread
Subject: fine hairs
Message:
Respect = to accept the right to exist. Without interference. Even interference to try to improve.

Honor= to recognize qualities

Admire= to accept that we feel inspired by someone

These days the definition of Respect seems to come from a Rap song. It does not have to do with admiration or sympathy or antipathy

To me respect doesnt depend on good qualities or approval.

Honor relates to being in agreement with.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 15:43:38 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: trixie
Subject: Really, it's a tricky word, this 'respect'
Message:
The word's pretty tricky in this respect. As a noun, 'respect' surely means what I say it does: 'deferential esteem felt or shown towards a person or quality'-- (Oxford). If you have respect for someone, that's what you've got.

But as a verb, the word lends itself to both meanings. Again, Oxford:

1) regard with deference, esteem, or honour.

and:

2) avoid interfering with, harming, degrading, insulting, injuring or interrupting.

Personally, I think that's pretty shitty. I think the word's evolved somewhat euphemistically. I mean tell me there isn't confusion just waiting to happen -- and be exploited, for that matter -- between 1 and 2.

Anyway, I'm wrong in a way. I have to concede it's okay to say that 'we should all respect each other' and mean the second meaning. I admit that. However, I'd be very careful to see if someone isn't really trying to squeeze the much stronger implication of 1 into a sentence ostensibly asserting 2. Know what I mean? When Bjorn or anyone says 'we should all respect each other', what are they really saying? I'd be interested in an etymological study of this word which, I still think, has, in some sense, been seriously debased.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sun, Apr 16, 2000 at 01:47:18 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Really, it's a tricky word, this 'respect' Yep
Message:
Yes I see what you mean. I had the caution and thats why I mentioned it-but I didnt look at it as a difference between noun and verb ect.

squeezing #1 into a sentence that could be taken as a 2 is the kind of manipulation that is laced throughout the cult propaganda. Though not in the same way. There are so many layers of interpretations which are used as a foundation in the cult dogma it is quite sophisticated really.


Free is one
stay in touch is another

would take a web site devoted to deprogramming to unravel the mess.

I have a book on english usage that goes into this stuff. Cant find it though.

Thanks

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 16:15:51 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: tricky word, this 'respect'??? Really?
Message:
tricky word, this 'respect'??? Really?

Origin: Latin:

re = again

spect = something to do with looking? as in spectacle, spectator, inspect ... etc.

That's it - spectare: to look.

Look again?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 15:17:06 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: a good way to look at 'respect'
Message:
Thanks cq,

An excellent starting point! Instead of passing judgement on the first glance, look again, consider the whole person, the whole context (you say you don't know the person or their context that well??) . . . Once you start looking and reflecting, judgement doesn't come so easily. Is that a bit more helpful Jim?

Stonor

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 16:25:25 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: That's not very helpful, Chris
Message:
The original root for a word is just the starting point in defining it. It's rarely the definition itself.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 17:04:29 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Point taken (in some instances) Jim, but:
Message:
Point taken (in some instances) Jim, but - as with the word 'de-finition' - doesn't that imply some kind of eternal relevance to the meaning that word began with? (de= from; finis=end)

Just 'cos some idiot like Michael Jackson comes along and tells us that 'wicked' now means 'bad' now means 'cool' now means 'hot' ... etc.

You get the idea?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 17:16:44 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: cq
Subject: But .......no
Message:
Chris,

Don't know what 'eternal relevance to the meaning' means but, if it's anything like 'constant meaning' I'd say no. Words change all the time. What I don't like is when people try to get away with switching connotations on ambiguous words. Well, that's just one of the tricky word games I don't like.


Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Mon, Apr 17, 2000 at 16:47:07 (GMT)
From: cq
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: With respect to that respect of 'respect' ...
Message:
Hi Jim,

You’re quite right if you’re saying that some words do change their meaning, Jim, but I think I referred to “... relevance to the meaning that word BEGAN WITH” , ie for as long as we use a word, its original meaning will have SOME relevance to the various permutations of meaning it comes to acquire.

i.e. Fred Flintstone can still have a “gay old time” without everyone thinking he’s a shirt-lifter ‘cos we still know what the word gay CAN mean in the context.

Actually, I wonder how many examples can be found of words that have lost all connection with their original definition?

There’s “presently”, which in Shakespeare’s time used to mean “immediately”; then there’s the word “politician” - in his day if you called someone a “politician” it would be taken as a severe insult. (Wonder if the word “guru” is headed that way?)

Any etymological study HAS to take in the origins of a word, as well as its later meanings (and with respect to that (!) of course I just had to look up its own origin, which I didn’t know came from “etymon” which is “the word that gives rise to a derivative or a borrowed or later form” which in turn comes from the greek “etumos” = “true”). So now we know.

Somewhere in this thread you asked: “Question: should ‘respect’ mean anything?”

I’d have to say “of course”, unless you’re into post-modernist deconstruction of language. Funnily enough (i.e. slightly strangely enough) one of the books I’m currently borrowing from the library has a paragraph or three about this very subject (the book? “The Complete Idiot’s Guide to Philosophy”, - which is ... apt).

It cites the writings of the Frenchman, Jacques Derrida (b 1930) who developed the whole idea of “deconstruction” - “the practice of taking apart a piece of writing to show how, in spite of itself, it fails to produce the consistent, reliable sense it aims at”.

I’ll have to quote a bit more, ‘cos this is all a bit new to me:

“Deconstruction is the practice of unraveling meaning from written language to show how what’s written is put together out of assumptions that can’t be true.
Derrida emphasised the inability of language to refer to a fixed, stable meaning. Borrowing from Husserl, he called this inacessible meaning “prescence”.
*Presence* is the idea that the meaning of words is limited by the intentions of the speaker or writer.”

The author goes on to cite the word that this Derrida bloke invented: “differance” (spelt with an “a”, unlike the ordinary word, “difference”). “It refers to the idea that the meaning of any word depends not so much on what it refers to, but how it relates to, and differs from, other words. In French the words for “differ” and “defer” are spelt the same way: “differance”. Both concepts are suggested by the one word. Words do not simply contain meaning: they defer their ability to have meaning to other words in the language. As a result, meaning is always slipping away. “






I can relate to that.




(And you thought my previous post wasn’t very helpful!)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 09:55:05 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Daneane
Subject: Respect / Daneane.
Message:
I like that one Daneane. Who should sit on the panel?

Judgement's not merely a word, it's a sentence!

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 18:55:31 (GMT)
From: Stonor
Email: None
To: Hal
Subject: Nice Hal, very nice. (nt)
Message:
Nice hal, very nice. (nt)
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 21:48:17 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: The main difference between us...
Message:
in my perspective, Jim, is that you seem to be sure you know.
And I can spot no hope, love or faith in your writing. You spend your life arguing, ridiculing and mentally abusing people who dont share your mindset.

I admit I dont know. But at least I aspire to have hope, faith and love.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:47:02 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Faith is a weakness, hope is good and love?
Message:
Robbie,

I love you! I love you, I love you, I love you. I love you, Robbie. All I feel when I think of you is love, deep, profound brotherly love. So we're not so different after all, see?

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 20:52:29 (GMT)
From: Way
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: To Robbie
Message:
Dear Robbie,

Don't mind Jim. He talks to everyone like that. But his point, I assure you, is valid. You do sound like you are cultishly repeating the standard programming for premies: 'I'm feeling such peace and my Master Maharaji deserves the credit.'

I don't want to ask you to reveal yourself, but could you say when you received Knowledge and what country you are from? It would really help to know those things if you plan on continuing to debate with us. Also, were you ever in the ashram?

You do have one major thing in common with Rob. He posted under false pretenses, switching from one fake persona to another, to the point that nobody could really believe him when he ended up claiming that he had become suicidal. You say that you conducted some tests here with scary results. I hope you are through with your tests and can be a little more unfront, otherwise forget about the respect you say you deserve! Around here, we respect honesty and being straightforward.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:17:26 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: To Way
Message:
You wrote
'I hope you are through with your tests and can be a little more unfront, otherwise forget about the respect you say you deserve! Around here, we respect honesty and being straightforward.'

Dear Way
Basicly I consider myself to be really honest and straighforward. I try to keep it that way. But due to my experience, this Forum is indeed not a place to pursue honesty and straightforwardness.

What I write is however honest and sincere, and I think those things I write should be discussed, not my person.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 22:53:28 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: Way
Subject: By the Way
Message:
you and trixie are correct. I have posted under different names.
I have posted under the names of Robbie, Robin Hood and Marion, Mr. Blockhead and under my real name Bjørn and some other names. So stop wandering, this Rob I don't know anything about.

From time to time I will 'reincarnate' here at the Forum, if it is under my real name or if I pick another name, I dont know.

As I have stated, I have no intensions to convert expremies, however I think the Forum has slightly improved that not so many fake 'premies' (expremies pretending to be premies) are posting here anymore and the 'hate level' has been somehow reduced. I hope however that what is written here is more based of facts and not dubious rumours. Bye

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 00:51:54 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: You should be blocked -- FA?
Message:
Where's a cop in this town when you need one? This idiot here is posting under several names contrary to one of the only 'rules': thou shalt not post under different names. If you're not going to do anything about it then please let us all know and we can stop thinking there is such a rule.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 07:28:39 (GMT)
From: Bjørn
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Who should be blocked from FA?
Message:
You wrote:'...is posting under several names contrary to one of the only 'rules': thou shalt not post under different names.'

If you are not really blind or unable to read and understand, I would say that simple observations make it clear that most of those who post here, post under different alias.(f. inst. trixie - Zelda) If everyone who post under a fake name should be blocked, about half of the people who post here should be blocked. One thing is for sure, at least I do not try to pretend to be somebody I am not. Some people even pretend to be Maharaji or his kids, but I assume that you think that is OK.
At least I confess my 'sins'.

Another thing that is pretty clear is that you and a lot of people and the Forum are breaking the laws of the society. But you think that is OK too?

You should also be aware of that when you are a premie, you are regarded as an enemy and because of the 'lie' concepts expremies have placed upon my person, it is absolutely impossible to have a fruitful discussion. The way I see it if I want to post here at all, I have to take different names. What surprises me is that expremies are so slow to spot who I am. Are you sleeping or what? Even I can spot some of those who post under false names, because I recognise their way of thinking and expressing themselves.

By the way I will again take a brake. Bye.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Sat, Apr 15, 2000 at 22:03:53 (GMT)
From: Bjorn reader
Email: None
To: Bjørn
Subject: Bjorn,some advice
Message:
Very simply, regardless of your politics you said a while ago you would not post here. You are spineless - that is in English you have no backbone - that is- you do not stand by your word - that is- you say one thing yet do another- that is- your word can not be trusted- that is- you have forked-tongue- that is- you do not stand by your convictions...if you say something...do it...it is very empowering...try it.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Fri, Apr 14, 2000 at 15:17:54 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: Bjørn
Subject: Coem on, FA's -- you've got a job to do!
Message:
Look, here's this guy who's blatantly adsmitting that he posts under different names to trick people into thinking that they're actually different people. Now either there's a rule against that or not. If there isn't, please let me know and I'll quit carping about it. If there is, block him.
Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 10:50:06 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Trixie- Look carefully at this
Message:
I am not searching for happines - I have it. Along with caution about a charlatan.. This is normal.
I would of course try to help people who may wish to avoid the trap.

We are not all searching for happiness as a co dependant of this man.

You are not good at being inarticulate.

Keep posting here, it is the best form of teaching - rehashed
satsang for us to learn from.

What you dont get is that people have happiness - they just dont have the narcissic drive to prostelize about it. This site to let us exercise the human impulse to help our fellow man. Something you may only know how to do by regurgitating something you heard.

Keep doing it - it goes into print and then studied by the local guru detox support group. You are one of the best examples we have!

If you are not Rob- you are doing pretty good

Tell us more.
Whats that about That Peace and That Happiness?
Please talk about how miserable the exs are compared to you and the rest of the premies. And how we cannot judge someone elses experience- we need you to elaborate on that one.

I think it is about time I switched to Zelda........

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 14:36:36 (GMT)
From: Robbie
Email: None
To: trixie
Subject: Trixie- Look carefully at this
Message:
I wrote we are searching for happiness. A more correct way to describe what I meant is: 'in my opinion we are all pursuing happiness'

Otherwise I dont feel superior to anyone. My observation is that some expremies tend to have an attitude I dont like.

I know nothing about Rob.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:20:00 (GMT)
From: Jim
Email: None
To: x
Subject: Look at what the cult is reduced to!
Message:
You know, I got sucked into this whole fucking cult for a couple of reasons, not the least of which was a strong curiosity about life. Like what the hell was this thing anyway? Were there magic stratas of cosmic consciousness, worlds beyond worlds, each more fantastic than the last? Was it even possible that the Lord of all creation could possibly take a human body to answer that question? And could I keep enough of an open mind to simply ask for that 'Superman comic' and find out about these things?

Sure, it was eminently naive. We all know that. But, guess what? It was alive!

Now look at these people! From being open-minded (hey, admittedly too much so) the cult members have become real, live

Know-Nothings!

Disgusting, isn't it? Ironic, pitiful and disgusting.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 07:21:44 (GMT)
From: x
Email: None
To: Jim
Subject: Look at what the cult is reduced to!
Message:
>Now look at these people! From being open-minded (hey, admittedly too much so) the cult members have become real, live
Know-Nothings!

This is where you have limited your own view.
What you have stated is really not what is happening.

But at least you still have ambition and a desire to do something.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 04:09:12 (GMT)
From: Jean-Michel
Email: None
To: x
Subject: Why ?
Message:
Simple enjoyment appears to be too simple for some people.

What's involved is not that simple.

Like saying that the enjoyment of drinking wine is simple. You can drink wine almost anywhere, specially here in France, but there is a lot involved regarding your health and social relationships.

Same thing with Mr Rawat. Be careful.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 16:40:13 (GMT)
From: Mike
Email: None
To: Jean-Michel
Subject: Drinking wine simple?
Message:
JM: I have to say that my wife and I shared the best bottle of wine I've ever had the pleasure to 'experience.' We just had it last week: A Bordeaux vintage 85.... Yes, I said 85. It was worth the wait! That was the year that my wife and I first met and the year that I got a major promotion. We held it for a special occasion and WOW!!!!! The flavor just 'melted' on our palates! What a wonderful year..... 85.

Enjoying that bottle was anything but simple. What a complex flavor and finish! Damn, I only had ONE bottle from that year! :-)

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:03:40 (GMT)
From: Daneane
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Ummm..what was that word? Propagation?
Message:
In just my minimal aspirant experience, it seems to me this was a big theme with big M. Isn't he then encouraging his flock to spread the word?

If I go to an event and I am told about M and to believe in M...well, I am the event and probably it would be pretty goofy to ask them not to talk about that.

So, since you are at the Ex-Premie Bar...doncha think maybe talking about leaving his Grace might not be terribly out of line?

Anyway...people here have only given me the rest of the story...they didn't keep me from the M. They just made sure I had all the information for a more sound decision.

Frankly, I'm a believer that there is good to be gleaned from the themes which M discusses. He may not be much of a source, I think, but the ideas are real. I just don't know how to truly reap the good in those ideas without exploring them beyond his intro and his influence. It troubles me really; seeing a long history of spiritual and philosophical thought manipulated into some secret way cracked only with his guidance and calls for gratitude.

It reminds me of when I was buying a new car. I read a bunch of books about car buying. Of the seven or so I read; three were written by salesmen. Fortunately, I happened upon one with an intro by Ralph Nader who pointed out those 'helpful books' written by the wolves.

Yeah, yeah, research 101, 'always check your sources'.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:58:23 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Daneane
Subject: My experince going back to M, Slightly Sci Fi!
Message:

Hi Deneane

You have it right. It is the 'call for gratitude' that alarmed me.
I was a premie since the early 70s. Practiced all through the 80s but didnt go to programs.
Then some premies told me how it had all changed so much.
So I went to a program- feeling pretty neutral - expecting to have a positive experience though.

During the program I listened carefully for how it was different- and the words spoken about staying 'in touch' and 'gratitude' gave me the creeps.

The knowing nods and premie behavior towards Maraji/knowledge made it evident that things had not changed. The expectations from and about M were still alive and well- just more politically correct.

There was less fawning going on- as if the crowd had been vaccintaed against outward display.

The apparently harmless 'stay in touch'spoken by Maraji hit me like a poisoness gas.

But my caution was pronounced when I saw what wasnt happening with the premies. My knowledge of personal interaction, within relationships and parterships illustrated that long term premies had serious dysfunctions due to their cult involvemant. If the family life was centered on the cult- things were ok. If not there was trouble.
This single thing is a textbook symptom. And I smelled danger.

You dont need me to tell you all this. It sounds like you follow your intuition about it.

As for the principals he speaks of, I agree with you. But not through this cult.

My suggestion is to find the techniques on the net, possibly through this site, and use them. If they bring you peace and happiness it will be through your own integrity as you practice them.

If you believe or experience a higher power in your life, your thinking and intuition are your allies.

Not everyone here would agree with me on that! so be forewarned
;)

Nice to know you are out there
Trixie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 01:56:01 (GMT)
From: trixie
Email: None
To: To Deanne
Subject: FA Posting this again- Replys to Rob get deleted..
Message:
This is the second time that my posts have been deleted. Some times they show up on the tread and sometimes they dont.
Both times it was when I replied to Rob or commented on something he said. The last time was a couple of weeks ago late at night.
He is geeking. Ya, I know I know-- 'thats not possible' but it is happening
.
Anyway

Hi Deneane
You have it right. It is the 'call for gratitude' that alarmed me.

I was a premie since the early 70s. Practiced all through the 80s but didnt go to programs.

Then some premies told me how it had all changed so much.

So I went to a program- feeling pretty neutral - expecting to have a positive experience though.

During the program I listened carefully for how it was different- and the words spoken about staying 'in touch' and 'gratitude' gave me the creeps.

The knowing nods and premie behavior towards Maraji/knowledge made it evident that things had not changed. The expectations from and about M were still alive and well- just more politically correct.

There was less fawning going on- as if the crowd had been vaccintaed against outward display.

The apparently harmless 'stay in touch'spoken by Maraji hit me like a poisoness gas.

But my caution was pronounced when I saw what wasnt happening with the premies. My knowledge of personal interaction, within relationships and parterships illustrated that long term premies had serious dysfunctions due to their cult involvemant. If the family life was centered on the cult- things were ok. If not there was trouble.

This single thing is a textbook symptom. And I smelled danger.

You dont need me to tell you all this. It sounds like you follow your intuition about it.

As for the principals he speaks of, I agree with you. But not through this cult.


My suggestion is to find the techniques on the net, possibly through this site, and use them. If they bring you peace and happiness it will be through you own integrity as you practice them.

If you believe or experience a higher power in your life, your thinking and intuition are your allies.

Not everyone here would agree with me on that! so be forewarned
;)

Nice to know you are out there
Trixie

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 01:26:31 (GMT)
From: Oliver
Email: None
To: Trixie
Subject: My experince going back to M, Slightly Sci Fi!
Message:
Trixie

I agree with all of your post except for one thing. Your suggestion to D to learn the techniques. There are many other meditation techniques 'on the market' that are superior to M's and far less difficult to carry out. Why spend 15 minutes tasting mucus and trying to decide what benefits there are in so doing?

My suggestion to D is to shop around, buy or borrow some books but stay away from the type of teacher who wraps the meditation up in some pseudo spiritual mumbo jumbo. After all, there all just different types of relaxation techniques.

Oliver

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 22:31:55 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: Why mess around?
Message:
Junkies also experience peace and happiness. Heroin works very well for them. They say leave us alone it's our choice and we're not hurting anyone.

Luckily there are people around who will point out to them that they're not facing real life and deluding themselves. They are also likely to be enticing others into their delusion.

Robbie, if you're happy with Maha, fine. You must however realise what this site is about. If you have no doubts or questions then maybe it's better not to read what's posted here.

I gave Maha a very good try and it didn't get me anywhere but into dis-ease and delusion.I too thought that it was bringing me peace and happiness but now realise it was a big lie.

Ask the people who are around you how much peace and happiness you emmanate. You may be surprised to find that you don't transmit what you think you do. Maybe I'm wrong and you have realised Truth, but I've never met a premie who has.

Best wishes , Hal

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Thurs, Apr 13, 2000 at 00:18:12 (GMT)
From: Trixie
Email: None
To: Robbie
Subject: This is not a popularity contest.
Message:
Whether you like me or not is irrelevant.
Take a look at your Guru, Robbie. Talk about telling people what to do- he is doing that in a sinister manner- lulling the peimies with endless talk of THAT peace and happines while he is cementing them into a co dependance. They must leave no room for doubt-especially about him..

Rob, you interject in order to deflect premies attention.
Like Hal said above, you know what this site is about.
You are on patrol here.

Premies-- you can learn alot about the tactics Maraji cultivates by observing Rob's behaviour on the forum. When and where he comes in demonstrates brainwashing in action.

Ingratiating

A self appointed Knight errant working for the dark force.

It is good he is here because he is such a good example of Marajis work.

Return to Index -:- Top of Index

Date: Wed, Apr 12, 2000 at 20:15:36 (GMT)
From: Hal
Email: None
To: Trixie
Subject: Great Trixie, I like your posts. (nt)
Message:
sdfgh
Return to Index -:- Top of Index