Ex-Premie.Org |
Forum I Archive # 8 | |
From: Jun 18, 1997 |
To: Jul 15, 1997 |
Page: 1 Of: 5 |
Date: Tues, Jul 15, 1997 at 17:20:18 (EDT)
Poster: WOULD YOU PLEASE Email: right here To: FOR A CHANGE Subject: FLY RIGHT Message: Frank Sinatra had his life story told in a book called My Way and the whole book is story after story of real bad personal behavior and interspersed were good public events (singing). That is how your story will be if you dont shape up and fly right. supposidly your father said no one can teach you. You know what you should do but you just dont care enough about the consequenses to you and others. Drop the brahmin stuff. there already is a power so dont pretend you are any closer to it than anyone. You stop seeing others as lesser humans. We are all equal. you are
cursed and you are doing it to yourself. We dont need your selfish illusion
handed to us as a package deal with knowledge. Will you ever grow up enough to
lose your self absorbtion? The more you cling the more inevitable another big
hit is . If you want to play revealer of knowledge the responsibility to fly
right comes with it Already you have abused your opportunities in your life
and death is hovering. Why dont you fully wake up? Its not like climbing mt
everest. Its not grafting on humility for a few minutes. Its doing what you
need to do and not making excuses. Thanks a lot for taking so long.
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Date: Tues, Jul 15, 1997 at 13:24:27 (EDT)
Poster: chuck Email: www.cletron@mailcity.com To: Everyone Subject: miami beach premie search Message: I'm a premie. I lived in Miami Beach from 1980-90. I've lost contact with my people there in the premie community. I'm currently looking to connect with the following people: Rick Corkell Cealo Churno Warwick Smith Tony Humpries I would also like to hear from any premies who were living in the Miami Community at that time. You can contact cletron.@mailcity.com Thanks Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Tues, Jul 15, 1997 at 07:09:58 (EDT)
Poster: WEB Email: To: Scott Subject: Thanks Scott Message: You ran a top quality site. And provided a good service I will miss your world here Thanks from all of us Off to the new forum! Will. Ed. Tom web Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 14:01:10 (EDT)
Poster: Scott Email: To: Everyone Subject: How to access the new newsgroup Message: Due to the fact that DJN isn't acting as fast as I had thought they would, I haven't yet been able to write a special URL to access our group via DJN. Once the forum closes down, if DJN still hasn't registered our new group, it may still be possible for you to access the new group via your own ISP server. Please check out my newsly revised, (Sunday PM.) FAQ about this at: - Scott
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 23:42:30 (EDT)
Poster: what maharaji said Email: tom To: Everyone Subject: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: When reading this keep in mind he is talking about himself very directly. You may not be used to how he talks about himself but it can sound like he is talking about others but this is the most revealing confession ever. The most apologetic comment he evermade was in the late 80's and was ' I'll take the blame for what happened til now'. 'just to
stop, to stop this nonsense, this game, this russian roulette you
play with your head all day long
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Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 00:05:36 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: what maharaji said Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: Thanks Tom! So those are my options,
huh? Either be soooooo saturated with clarity or
suffocate in the sewage of my doubts. Hmmmmm, can a I think
about it for a few days?
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Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 01:44:07 (EDT)
Poster: like you dont know Email: To: signs of life Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: When I first saw that video I felt it was his best ever. seeing him as lord for so long, it's been a real trip snapping out of it. It is frankly amazing that the guy with the knowledge has had that much of a cloud on his shoulders. If he can drop the rest of it he can be of some use. I am presently surrounded by aspirants and half-aspirants. I get calls from premies and one even spent the night last night cause they asked for a ride to the airport to go see guess who in miami. I dont say anything. What do I want? A full time job adjusting peoples illusions? To what? Christianity? I'm glad m is making human type sounds, in the program before this one, he looked up the definition of sincere,and it said 'without pretense or deciet' and he said 'is it possible to live like that?' So he definately was frank at the dec. event and the event on the 8th, he talked about being angry regularly, frequently, and how he has to stay in the feeling or he becomes stupid. His words. As a starry eyed gopi all the honesty finally started crashing my delusions. I saw the videos about the time I came across the website. I know that the knowledge is of great value. In spite of whatever stupid groups claim it is part of thier 'tradition'. If the god would play it's cards right, a lot of the religions and thier stupifying traditions could be left in history and womens opression could be lessened. Dark zealotry and caste systems could be dealt a fatal blow. Slavery in moslem countries surely could go, but oh well! The champion of knowledge is on a huge learning curve and time is passing. I wish him well, and if he hits a stride, I am sure that in the future, well just look at whats-his name-jesus, 17 years of his life just whoops! disappeared! I wonder why they edited those 17 years out? Could he have been on a screwy learning curve? God is involved, so you can count on it. I have plenty of relatives that of course think I'm nuts. He's really great, but that guru trip, sheesh! What do I tell them? Oh. you were right! your christianity is obviously the way to god. or, he's not the lord, but the knowledge is what you want. My friends at least know me and so they want knowledge cause I feel it and they can tell something is worth it. My -ahem- champion, has to saddle up on the lifeforce and stay on the damn thing till clarity does it's job. Is that possible? I just started laughing, I wonder what the actual perspective of the god power is. If I am going to relate to it, besides just feeling it, it would be nice to get a handle on what kind of character do we have here? This conciousness must have some kind of personality. Not just some distant bland power or hideous strength. I think the real conciousness might be cool. Not a religious dork, but an aware power that likes to keep itself under wraps, but is actually , well, like a boy scout! Trustworthy, loyal, helpful,friendly, courteous, kind,obediant?,cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and relavent. I think the obediant part is why it keeps itself under wraps, I am sure it is vulnerable to a living being. But I wont mess with that. That is too tricky and if I start to get close the power is not without defenses and I'll find myself more confused. Best of luck maharaji! what a life you have! Saddle up. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 10:52:24 (EDT)
Poster: Anon Email: To: what maharaji said Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: Forgive me if I am missing something but from reading this Satsang (that you have quoted) I don t find it conclusive that Maharaji is talking about himself particularly more than usual. I fail to see it as a revealing confession let alone the most revealing confession . Presumably you have quoted him verbatim - All I derive from this is as follows, and I challenge anyone to explain how they impute any other meaning to his words. (The plain text is my precis of his words and the parenthesis are my comments and the Italics are of course, his original words) just to stop, to stop this nonsense, this game, this russian roulette you play with your head all day long We are playing a nonsensical game of Russian Roulette with our heads. (Our predicament is more serious than we may imagine!) We should just stop it. (of course) Do you know what it is like to live in sewage? I did not live in sewage but I got mighty close to it. I mean, ohhh, it's, horrible,horrible, the stench, the dirt, the filth, EVERWHERE. It is horrible, and believe me I know you are afraid of sewage, and you should be. But, there is another kind of sewage that I know of. Because sewage, actually, left alone, can sort itself out. But the human sewage of the mind, there is no bacteria for it. The sewage, can be thrown in the ocean,so far it is not in giant quantities, if may be able to perculate and filter itself out. But the human sewage of the mind, there is no ocean that can take that. Human sewage can be thrown in rivers and it will carry it away. But, the mental sewage, there is no river that will carry it, there is no bacteria that.will eat it, there is no leach field that will clean it. He did not live in sewage but has been close enough to know it is unpleasant. (presumably this is the bit that suggests to you that Maharaji is talking about his own brush with the Mind- isn t it rather a tenuous link between his words and such a conclusion?) Sewage is biodegradable. Mental sewage is not. (scary stuff, this mental sewage..again his tone alone is probably enough to impress one that there is truly something lurking within to be afraid of) And what is it? That anger, that fear, that doubt, that darkness that the human being is constantly plagued by, and has placed himself in that place. He describes mental sewage as a place of anger, fear and doubt where human beings have put themselves. (Arguably anger ,fear and doubt are natural responses and defence mechanisms which thus have their place as a valid and God given part of our human nature- anyway is he saying he has no anger, doubt and fear?) To doubt, to doubt where there can be clarity, where there should be clarity, my god, talk about the ultimate sin, here is one. Where there should be clarity, where there should be light, there resides darkness, now that's a crime, where there should be joy, there is sadness, where there should be clarity, there is doubt. Where there should be love, there is hate, where the person, should be embracing the moment called now, the person is stuck in yesterday, Where the person should be free, the person is caged, imprisoned. It is a sin and a crime that ,where there should be clarity, light, love, joy and living in the present, there is doubt, darkness, hate, sadness and living in the past instead. (Again, are not doubt, hate and sadness natures warning signals that something is wrong, and/or symptoms of social disease? It is simplistic and not particularily constructive to propose that Maharaji s path of knowledge will wholly address all these problems) You know, the bars made out of metal can be cut. And thus a prisoner can escape from a prison, but the bars, of the anger, and the fear, and the doubt, and the darkness, there is no blade manmade that will cut it. And it is the prison of the worst kind. Where there should be consciousness and consciousness has no place. Man cannot extricate himself from the dreadful unconscious prison of his own fear and anger. (My experience is that we do have tools to extricate ourselves from our fears and psychoses; sure we have a long way to go, but do Premies really display such enlightened behaviour that marks them as being freer than the average person from such afflictions? I think not, and often it would seem that they suffer more fear and anger and arrested development than the average person) I'm talking about life, the promise, the possibility in this garden to have spring forever. There can be an eternal spring in this garden of life . (What evidence is there of this? The picture on the front of the Jehovas Witness rag, The Watchtower ) I'm talking about to be fulfiled and to know, not just believe, you are fulfiled. Not somebody comes along and says now you are happy, but to be happy because you ARE happy. Not because somebody comes along and says now you don't have any doubts, but to not have any doubts because you are SATURATED with clarity. We can be fulfiled through certain knowledge and not just through belief or because we are told that we are happy. (99.9 % of people naturally prefer to be certain about things! It is general knowledge that beliefs and suggestions are not replacements for subjective experiences ) This is how life should be, and this is how life can be, and this is how life MUST be! And do you know why? Because we are human beings, We are alive, THESE are the gifts that were given to us, by the very thing that put us on the face of the earth. In our life we should and must be saturated with clarity for this is our heritage as living human beings. (I agree that clarity is a possibility for us humans but I have experienced from giving Maharajis Knowledge a good try that sometimes the feeling of being saturated with clarity are a rather juvenile delusion.) I cannot ask you to do something that you cannot do, I cannot ask myself to something that I cannot do, Maharaji cannot ask us to do something that he can t. Neither can he put impossible demands on himself- ( I suppose Maharaji himself could easily give up relationships with the opposite sex, drink, worldly pursuits etc. and live in the ashram too? Just like he asked me to do. Moreover I suppose he too could happily sit and listen to 5 months of Videos as he currently asks of aspirants) But to accept the joy in my life has to my priority. That much, I know. That much, I understand, I have nnnooooo problem with that, none. (Unlike most people?) Maharaji wants joy in his life as a priority. He has no problem with this. What will be will be. Can I be afraid? Oh yeah, I can paint a picture for myself that can be frightening. He too can ( if he will ) paint a picture for himself that is frightening. ( I suppose this is a reference to the fact that we are all capable of being unneccessarily afraid of certain situations that arise in life) There is a simple feeling in me that is perfect, It is simple. When I am in that one place within, I rest, I become me, I become whole, I begin to be in awe of life. My whole world becomes real and I begin to be in awe of each breath I take within me When in the place within (that feels simple and perfect) he becomes wholly himself, and is rested. He starts to feel that life is awesome as a result. Additionally, his entire world becomes real (sweeping statement!) and breathing also becomes awesome. When you take away the confident tone, or feeling with which Maharaji delivers his words one is left with less substance. Indeed, a lot of what he says is perfectly common sense and of no great news to most people. His over-emphasis on the obvious woes of mankind and the accompanying suggestion that Knowledge alone is the answer to our problems makes little sense to me so far. This is in consideration of the observed effect that he has had on myself and others. Whilst I appreciate the benefits of Meditation, I sense danger in it s teaching being the preserve of one man who considers himself the sole Master of the subject. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 14:52:48 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Anon Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: I have to agree. Tom, you might be absolutely right in suspecting Maharaji's comments say much about his own self-appraisal but I have to agree with Anon that the revelations are unintentional. Face it, there's no way either Maharaji or any of his apologists would ever admit what your commom sense dictates is obvious. I'm with Anon in that regard. Maharaji's criticising you and me, not himself. By the way, it's refreshing to see Maharaji use a dictionary for a change. Last time I looked he'd defined 'sincerity' as 'having no doubts'. When you fuck with the language you fuck with the software. N'est-ce pas? So how come you guys aren't tuning in
to the newsgroup instead of this hoary old thing? The only posts
there so far are mine and some junk mail. But you know Tom,
you're not going to be able to change your tag each time you log
in. Does that stifle your creativity a bit, you decidedly
'poetic' ex-premie, you? Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah!
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Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 01:50:19 (EDT)
Poster: future target Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: Actually, I think you are right. He cant let go of the above us thing. You have been hitting on something else that I think I am finally getting, JW mentioned it very recently in respose to you. As I have been discovering it in my life recently, I am calling it self respect. I feel a thread. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 08:46:04 (EDT)
Poster: groveling slug Email: To: Anon Subject: Re: friday night dec. 7 96 Message: Hi Anon I think it's revealing of how much I valued a small amount of perhaps humility. Would you consider weighing in on the subject of self respect, or whatever, in regardes to my self-respect labeled post that is in another thread. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 23:30:28 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Everyone Subject: Pics for New Yorker Message: I just noticed this post on the 'inner confusion' board: 'I am
seeking photographs of the Guru Maharaji for an article in an
upcoming issue. Anyone with information please call me at
(212)536-5813.
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 23:11:11 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Everyone Subject: SURFS UP!! Message: I have the nerdish priviledge of procaliming that, thanks to Scott, the newsgroup's up and running. Check it out at alt.cult.maharaji What I had to do was email my server and ask them to add it. It took them about a minute. Thanks
again Scott
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Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 22:56:06 (EDT)
Poster: Quite Email: To: All Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: On the way to the Forum, a funny thing happened.... Over at the new alt.cult.maharaji group, it's only been really running for one day and already there are a number of new voices over there. One Mrs. Verity Brooks who recently "saw the light", real light that is, about M. after 23 years of illusion as one of the sheep of his fold. One new current premie who may or may not stick around. and two or three other new names I've never seen over here. (Also ther is the unfortunate odd piece of graffitti that comes in from bulk advertisers over there!) Different place over there. By the way, I've changed the link to Altopia on the FAQ. Check it out via the link below for help on getting to the new discussion group. - Scott PS: Four more days and counting for the ole Forum.
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Date: Sat, Jul 12, 1997 at 23:13:57 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Quite Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: Scott, Any idea why I can't read Verity's post? Is this what you're talking about
when you say not all posts on usenet make it to all servers? Is that why I
should bite the bullet and get this Altopia thing?
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Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 13:56:12 (EDT)
Poster: Scott Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: Scott, Any idea why I can't read Verity's post? Is this what you're
talking about when you say not all posts on usenet make it to all
servers? Is that why I should bite the bullet and get this
Altopia thing?
- Scott
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Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 14:51:28 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Scott Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: Only 18 and that's including my last taht you couldn't have thought of (unless, you are enlightened). Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 15:14:13 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: So I've gone ahead and signed up for Altopia. But I'm a little burned that I have to pay anything extra at all just to read a newsgroup. Anyways, now I'm waiting for confirmation. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 23:41:58 (EDT)
Poster: cowabunga! Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: SURFS UP!! Message: At&t seems to have no problem with getting to the new site. I will miss Scotts World. Scott has done a remarkable job. It's good Jim has some time to police that new site. And fend off some divine lunacy. maitreya was a nutward. But it kind of showed me how gopis are a dime a dozen and how when the other sheep are bleating it sounds so familiar. Good grief! Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 22:39:23 (EDT)
Poster: Anon Email: To: Everyone Subject: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: We know that MJ will defend his beloved father to the bitter end when the latter is accused of 'beating' people for any reason other than love. He was Maharaji's father after all. The points you make tread frankly and angrily on the beliefs of Maharaji and his followers who obviously feel that there were more honourable motivations for Shri Hans' 'angry' words and deeds. Put bluntly, if one criticises Shri Hans too aggressively here, MJ and others will probably be so 'emotionally' offended by the attacks that their participation in any reasonable debate over the fundamental issues will be jeopardised. Before things get to personal, in other words, let me suggest that the crux of the matter is: To what extent is it acceptable to us that our Master chastise and tease us his pupils (for whatever loving motive) if the end effect is that we suffer intimidation as a result? Arguably, good parents use a certain amount of fear inducing behaviour to control and protect their children. If one extends the usefulness of this principle to so called Masters then it may go some way to explain why they present their charges with the possibility that they will suffer badly if they don't follow their instructions. The trouble is that as humans we can and do, to a large extent actually learn from our past mistakes. This is evolution. Thus in retrospect the dark,vice like grip that the Medieval church had over Europe (and indeed the world) can be seen as the sinister and potent oppressive force that it truly was. While I was in Madrid, I happened to visit the 'Prado' museum where hang the grim reminders of mans former fears of Hell, Damnation and eternal suffering, in the tortured paintings of Hieronymous Bosch. Thus also in retrospect we may reasonably say that in 1978 (or whenever) we were indeed (as trusting would-be students) motivated partly through apprehension as a result of the warnings and admonitions of our chosen Teacher. This also brings into question the extent to which our choice was really the active principle in "surrendering' ourselves in body and mind to Maharaji. Apologists for Maharaji's past methods continuously assert that because we chose to follow Maharaji then we should now accept the rough with the smooth as it were. It seems to me that there was indeed an element of persuasiveness that was not entirely healthy in the sometimes angry addresses of Maharaji and indeed his chosen spokespersons. We were all the more vulnerable to the oppressive effect of such preaching because Maharaji had won our trust through the more endearing side of his personality and through the apparent efficaciousness of the meditation he taught us. My real father loved and protected me (and he chased me with a stick once too! I don't resent him for that at all. He was born in 1898 and had to call his father 'Sir'. He, of course, truly loved me and was always available to help me in my life. I don't decry Maharaji's methods so much as that he did not so much love and protect me having gained my trust. He was not a 'good parent'. He was not my 'natural' guardian. He did not appear to reciprocate my devotion. I languished in his ashram for years, serving him and believing that I was where I should be in life. That is what he told me I should do. That turned out not to neccessarily be the case. It appears that by his own admission it was somewhat of a mistake. (This admission is historically vague I confess) Anyway, why should I trust him or his teachings now after awakening to what I feel is more the truth of the matter? That I was mislead. Anon Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 07:00:00 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: Anon Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: Well put, Anon. I was thinking the other day about what an asshole Maharaji was (yeah, I know, but this was a fresh thought, really). Maharaji consciously tried to get us to hate our lives, hate the world, hate ourselves all the while pretending that he was somewhere so infinitely better. 'I, I am in the infinite place! So, you too, you too must meditate, so you too can get to the infinite place.' Of course he stressed that we could never catch up, he would always be that far ahead. So what effect did that have? Well, those of us that bought it grew to hate ourselves. Any natural talents, characterstics, intelligence, emotions, relationships -- they were all suspect. All along, this asshole's telling us that we should keep settling for nothing in thisworld, not when Maharaji had something so much better for us. We spat out the food we might have enjoyed because he tricked our gullible little minds into trusting that he had something so much better for us. In the process we almost starved. If complete renunciation, absolute surrender (whatever the fuck that means) and tough, extreme guru-devotee stuff is not what he believes in (let alone true) he owes one major apology to everyone who bought that program. By the way, did you guys get my email? I sent out a little teaser to a bunch of the guru-lovers on Harlan's page. The only response I've gotten so far was from the guy who once posted this brilliant observation: ' The face of a child can say it all, especially the mouth part of the face.' He replied and I wrote back as follows: 'get me your fucking mailing list asshole, You mean "get me off your fucking mailing list
asshole" don't you, brother? Relax, consider this just another
piece of unsolicited email.
Your brother in his love, Jim
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 13:03:18 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: Excellent insights Jim. Sometimes I think I have my whole cult-guru past figured out. But what you said really summarized well what made GMJ so destructive to peoples' lives. What was even worse was that he made us unwitting accomplices in causing our own damage ("hating our own lives" as you so put it so well). Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 13:52:28 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: To: Anon Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: I don't know really what to say about GMJ's father. I always considered most of what I heard about him mythology or legend. I never thought it had much to do with my life or my relationship with Guru Maharaj Ji. As a premie, I liked that GMJ at least said that he was less tied to the past and I thought of him as a spiritual leader for the modern age and for the western world. The first time I saw him outside a program, he was jumping out of a Rolls Royce, and I thought that was very cool at the time, because he was flaunting the traditional image of a "holy man." I think you're right that the "motivation" behind MJ's more unsavory behaviors is a key issue. To use your parent/child analogy,if a parent punishes a child, either with physical pain, like spanking, or, probabaly more common, with psychological intimidation, out of love and in an effort to protect the child from harm, that might be appropriate. But what happens probably more often is that the parent is punishing/abusing the child at least partly for his or her own needs, because of his or her own frustrations, shame, hurt, etc. That kind of abuse creates humiliation and shame in a child and is very damaging. Because, I think, MJ verbally and sometimes physically attacked his devotees, not out of concern for them, but because of his own deficiencies and frustrations, that constitutes abuse and it produces the self-hatred that Jim described so well in his post. The abuse was also possible because, I, in trying to surrender to him like he instructed, was essentially vulnerable to him as a child is to a parent, even though I was an adult at the time. My psychological state in relationship to him was essentially as a child. Really, I'm not trying to sound too much like John Bradshaw here (who I think might like to be a guru himself, but nevertheless has a lot of helpful things to say), but the psychological damage that MJ has caused people flows, I think, from his own psychological problems. And who wouldn't have psychological problems living and being treated the way he has been, growing up with no "check" on his ever-expanding ego because everyone around him considered him perfect and would never question anything he did (except maybe his mother and he dumped her), and essentially also remaining psychologically as a child, but without the limits placed on a child and a child needs. [And we all know how cruel and destructive children can be to other people and small animals, now don't we.] Frankly, I doubt MJ has ever grown out of his immature and childish mindset. If he had, we might have heard at least some recognition from a more mature state that what he did as a child was unwise and harmful. And so, his anger and frustration just below (and sometimes above) the surface continues because he is truncated as a person, lashing out at his followers, the world, etc. as the cause of his frustrations, instead of looking at himself and seeing himself for what he really is. But I'm
not really surprised he hasn't done much self-examination and has
turned to rage and to alcohol instead, because that examination
for him would be very, very, very, painful and confronting.
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 21:14:58 (EDT)
Poster: oracle Email: To: JW Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: Maharaji DID go through a long period of freaked out reflection. That is why the book you refered to had the cryer section. He had a whopper of a midlife crisis precipitated by his mothers death. The story is all there in his videos. A little bit in this video, a little in that. I dont know of anyone else who watched the show. Thats all I looked for in his videos, this weeks realization. It was quite a ride. He said dont learn from death, thats the hard way. Something had to wake him up and it was his mothers death that broke his heart. He tried to make the clean break but he has reverted back to some previous approaches I mean good for him but it killed me that he had been so opposite of the lord . First, not the lord, then real bad behavior. ugh, really crushing, forget that parent master crap, he was the lord almighty although you guys were quicker to pick up on that. anyway, I will now quote maharaji from the december event I was going to mail you. In a thread Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 23:07:52 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: oracle Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: Bil, I DO find your posts interesting - sometimes -- and understandable others. Why not use one steady name? Nah, forget it. Do what thou will (hey look, I'm a pagan!). By the way, what exactly were you referring to a long time ago when you first logged on and promised some very revealing video stuff. Forget about the promise of the videos themselves. But what was the content? Jim
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Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 01:58:10 (EDT)
Poster: I'll find a name Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: I guess the video excerpt reveals just how rare humble expressions were if I valued such sparse offerings so highly. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 03:12:23 (EDT)
Poster: self respect Email: To: Jim Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: JW is right, you did hit it. One of the effects I see now, is that self respect was really affected. You are right. I gave myself away. And continue to do so. I am catching those around me now when they are disrespectful. Before I would not insist on ANY boundries. Maharaji gave this extreme example that is nuts but being the gopi I embraced it. It made me in fact subservient to ALL people. The example, a story about krishna and arjuna, was told at the 1979 peak of the devotional push, excuse me, the peak might have been 81. The story goes like this: (shortened) arjuna thinks he is a good devotee, krishna says -oh yeah? watch this and learn real devotion. krishna turns himself into a lion and tells arjuna to go to a kings house. The king greets them and arjuna says my lion is hungry and feed him your son. The king and queen agonize but quickly cave in. right then the lion turns back into krishna and krishna says-well? And arjuna says-- your right, I dont have devotion like that. meaning the real devotee trusts the lord so much and knows his lord is in all forms and if you believe that you can have your child be lunch for a lion at a strangers whim. The way he presented that was really powerfully for the local gopi. So I have let people walk all over me while I be nice and allow so much it's embarassing. Without me getting specific, let me assure you that I have put myself last always. It's tough for me to admit the endless specifics. The only other person who I know that was such a slavish gopi still, (I think there are others) but my miami friend chris standerwick has been at the residence garage since 85 and believe me he was a true gopi that If there was ever a lord on earth(I now dont think so, nice dream) Chris would be a historical devotee. Well, during the last year or two I get reports from people that work(is that the right word?) at m's house, that there is this wierdo in the garage named chris and they laugh and say- what planet is he from?-- this from lesser followers who dont know what a great guy he once was. That he looks wierd. Maharaji has crushed him I am sure. He has endured so much abuse and if you remember what it was like, there was nothing in it for you. recently, someone told me laughingly, that chris wouldn't go away and maharaji had to talk to him about him getting a job. And going away really. What did he do to chris? Chris got the position I wanted. Most premies of the time burned occasionally, but we lived a real daily passion and god protected us, but chris has had his face up against an unprotected reality of an endlessly unrequited love affair. And the idiots laugh. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 10:28:07 (EDT)
Poster: Jim Email: To: self respect Subject: Re: Let's be circumspect about all this. Message: It must be a big garage, Tom, becuase I've heard the same thing about an old ashram crony of my own, Bill Sparks. We lived in several ashrams together: Halifax, Ottawa, Calgary. In fact I couldn't get away from the guy! Bill was okay. A nice enough guy really but too serious. You know the type. Real boy scout. Nervous, excellent servous. Put a lot of us to shame. Made a lot of us think that if that's devotion maybe we didn't really want it. Othersie kind of alright guy. A bit pompous in his fervent zeal. Hey, life's complicated.... Anyways, I now hear Bill's called 'Sparky' and is, like your firned Chris I
guess, a fixture in the garage. He's been rewarded with what we all wanted: no
life. Deena told me about him.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 20:41:55 (EDT)
Poster: Mother Goose Email: To: Everyone Subject: A Good Bed-Time Story Message: Have you ever wondered what sort of nightmares M. might have had that drove him to drink? - Shri Hans comes to him saying, "Pali, (or whatever nickname he used to have for M.), Pali, your screwing up you know. Why did you have to give Nanna, (or whatever nickname they used to have for Mata Ji), such a hard time? You know you really were mean and disrespectful to her? Besides, I thought we were going to have world peace by now and you were going to be pretty much running things down there by now. What happened?" - "I'm sorry Babba, (or whatever nickname M. used to have for Shri Hans). You never told me about the things that would happen when I met Marilyn. I saw her and wow! Next thing you know we eloped and Nanna was on my case and you know, things just sort of went on a momentum of their own. As far as world peace, it's not my fault if the world isn't smart enough to recognize a perfect master when they see one." - Babba says, "But look
at you, your about fifty pounds over weight, you ruined Raju's,
(or whatever nickname they used to have for Raja Ji), marriage
with Claudia when you did you-know-what with her, you've got an
alcohol problem and now I just read all about you and these
things in the World Wide Web! Pali, you are really messing up!"
- Babba says, "OK Pali, I know you're doing the best you know how. It's not all a bed of roses you know. Don't give up the faith. Good bye now." - A plausible night mare?
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 02:03:26 (EDT)
Poster: an enabler Email: To: Mother Goose Subject: Re: A Good Bed-Time Story Message: Yes except that there is no excuse. he is not doing the best he knows how. He conciously chose againand again to be a monster to those around him. even in 97. his nightmare is that his heart is still not free. and that is his reality. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 12:13:50 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: To: an enabler Subject: Re: A Good Bed-Time Story Message: Can you be more specific? How is he being a "monster" to those around him? I've seen his diatribes in the past, and heard about how he could be cruel and sadistic to premies around him and to the initiators-in-training, but that was years ago and premies seem to think he is more civil now. Also, what was he saying about the word being like Mt. Everest. [By the way, have you read Krakaur's book, "Into Thin Air?" Riveting, but frightening, if you ever thought about ascending that particular mountain.] Also, do you have any other
details as to what he has actually said/done that reinforce your
vies? What was that about when he denigrated "volunteers," for
example?
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Date: Sun, Jul 13, 1997 at 23:47:04 (EDT)
Poster: hi jw Email: To: JW Subject: Re: A Good Bed-Time Story Message: I just noticed your post. I will respond tomorrow. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 16:22:58 (EDT)
Poster: Hey maharaji Email: here To: st peter Subject: your father is still in hell. Message: Dear st Peter. We are in a lobbying mood around here with the new site and all. The pros and the cons. I would like speak at the next parole hearing for maharaji's father when it might be his time to move from hell to purgatory. Not only did he beat innocent people with his cane but for some people he would just stop his car and beat them up over and over even though they weren't at a program or anything he already had beat them up before. Offering no resistance, of course that would be foolhardy, his father was a tall man in a small man world and his driver had murdered people in his life before and now he was working for the godfather. Much like gotti and his sidekick whats his name. Did I say sidekick? Thats right, he used to kick people too. In fact thats how he got his first devotee! True story! He had his sandals fixed by a lowest caste man and he didn't like the job so he said ---I am going to kick you beyond the three worlds!----and the simple indian innocent said---can you do that?--- of course shri hans said ---yes-- lying runs in the family! And big lies! no white lies for this clan. So he was pleased at someone taking him seriously so he didn't kick him then(maybe some other time). And gave him knowledge instead. He could yell his fool head off too. He would really have a major fit if someone dared piss him off (genetic insanity). Of course little godhead was learning at that time about how to behave. So who can blame him for lining up the servants in malibu and walking down the row punching people in the stomach one by one. But aha! he skipped one guy! And so that guy had a wonderful story to tell about how he was thinking this or that in his head and that is why the perfect monster didnt hit him. Let that be a lesson to the rest of them! And of course in miami he wanted to show up the security guys so he said --You have your hardware together,(guns?) but what about your software? -- and he used one finger to poke a guy in the right place in the ribs and broke a couple. It's not divine, its martial arts, and some security sap must have shown the little darling. Anyway, shri
hans has a lot to be responsible for.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 09:43:08 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: right here To: maharaji, of course. Subject: deca Message: Hello JW someone was talking about the paint shop. they said that two people developed cancer. Do you know who? I worked there. And the hanger where we got a huge dose of MEK. Regularly. the day started at 9 and ended at 2:30 am. After the 2:30 am meal arrived. I worked for the construction company too. One time they had a large oven to take down and it had one foot thick powdered asbestos all around it as insulation. The guys were shoveling it into bags. I complained and said dont you know what this is? They said yes and I told them to do it right. They didnt of course cause money was the only important factor so I went to the residence and wrote a note saying I was going to call the media or osha. and it would come back to maharaji and left the note on the gate. I didnt leave my name. I guess I knew back then the nature of the show. They got good respiraters for the workers but they still shoveled it out. If you know anything about the stuff you know what that means. short stroll. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 09:19:59 (EDT)
Poster: Hello Jim Email: truth reigns To: who ever cares Subject: no wonder you ran hot! Message: I read some of the archives and it shows your evolution on the website. You really were diplomatic. premies drove you to distraction by thier posts. I'm glad I wasn't around for the early wars with the trapped ones. Do you think that was really linda gross that posted the four conditions? posts by laura and others are really revealing about how strong the intense programing still is. He sits back and allows(excuse me!) orders the making of new recordings of the old songs. speaks with that aloof distain laced through his talks, talks about the relationship is based only on love and yet he hates people. ALL people. I think I'll take some strolls down memory lane Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 12:33:33 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: To: Hello Jim Subject: Re: no wonder you ran hot! Message: I read some of the archives and it shows your evolution on the website. You really were diplomatic. premies drove you to distraction by thier posts. I'm glad I wasn't around for the early wars with the trapped ones. Do you think that was really linda gross that posted the four conditions? posts by laura and others are really revealing about how strong the intense programing still is. He sits back and allows(excuse me!) orders the making of new recordings of the old songs. speaks with that aloof distain laced through his talks, talks about the relationship is based only on love and yet he hates people. ALL people. I think I'll take some strolls down memory lane Speaking of GMJ's hatred of people, I gather that the disdain for other people, including his own devotees, comes through in his satsang. Tom has mentioned this a few times. I recall noticing it myself the last time I saw him give satsang, which was 7 years ago at an introductory program in San Francisco. But in that same vein, I recently received a message from an ex-premie friend of mine who listened to one of his satsangs on tape (or whatever it is he calls it now and I don't know what posessed her to do it) and she had the following comment: "I actually
listened to a tape of him giving satsang in Australia recently...
He starts out for about half an hour retailing his adventures
getting a landing permit from various governments (how
fascinating, we should all have such problems) then launches into
his usual spiel about the purpose of our life, etc. What he's
saying isn't actually that off-the-wall, it's the tone he uses.
He has this holier-than-thou, I'm-god-and-you're-not-you-idiots
contempt in his voice that I find just totally obnoxious and
unbearable. It's like he's irritated about something, and I
don't know if it's because he has to do what he does for a living
and is frustrated, or he just doesn't like us. Anyhow,...just
thought you'd like to know that I actually listened this dumb
thing all the way through. He's so condescending and his voice
still sounds high-pitched and squeaky.
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Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 15:42:01 (EDT)
Poster: an enabler Email: To: JW Subject: Re: no wonder you ran hot! Message: It wasn't until the early nineties that you could listen to a video and not here him yell at least once. He used to yell through a lot of his speeches. I remember noticing that. and I remember one tape from the 80's that was a question and answer from boston that he didnt yell once. Iremember hearing him say that he got really mad and he said --I needed that--. I guess thats when he feels he comes alive. The only other routinely pissed off people I know are alchoholics. Or supposidly former alchoholics. Of course being a brahmin helps to give you that superiority feeling too. And short guys are sometimes afflicted by the small man disorder that time magazine says ross perot has. very dominating,obsessive,loves to present a public image of being in it for the benefit of others, while privately being in it for totally selfish and small minded ego reasons. Of course that kind of guy couldn't help himself from obsessing over this kind of insulting? website. which is why I am sure he comes by and swears. So I will give him something to look at. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Thurs, Jul 10, 1997 at 17:46:11 (EDT)
Poster: JW Email: To: an enabler Subject: Re: no wonder you ran hot! Message: Good points. Also interesting what you say about alcoholics. As you probably know, there appears to be plenty of evidence that Guru Maharaj Ji may well be an alcoholic. At least he apparently had a drinking problem for years, and I don't know if he ever got it under control or not. I hope for his family's sake he did. I can also recall him yelling in satsangs over the years. Sometimes premies were the target of his rage. [You know, that we hadn't surrendered yet or we listened to our minds, etc.] Other times it was the "people of the world", or human beings in general. He also used to bitch about how crowded places were (like, I recall, Disneyland and LAX and that they were getting more crowded, or that, heaven forbid, he might have to debase himself and talk to another passenger on an airplane.] It was like he was really pissed off that he had to cope with ANY of the inconveniences or irritations of being a normal human being. But when you are one of his programmed cult devotees, you don't see it as some kind of defect in the guy, you suspend your normal judgments and believe that whatever he is doing/saying is perfect, and any insights to the contrary are just evidence of your lack of understanding. I remember him really screaming at program in Denver in the late 70s. I remember this because my brother, who received knowledge in 1975 came to the program and was so turned off at how insulting Maharaj Ji was that he left the cult for good, much to my disappointment at the time. At that program I remember Maharaj Ji was really put out about the stage and said the stage looked like "a toilet" and really attacked the people of the world for not recognizing the perfect master (aka him). I remember feeling pretty freaked out after his satsangs, like I was really an unworthy devotee. I never, of course, considered that he was probably just acting out his own insecurity/psychological/substance abuse problems and that it really had nothing to do with the rest of us. If you read
The Guru Papers, the authors say that this rage comes when the
guru realizes that he really isn't some divine being and also
realizes he is NOT going to bring peace to the whole world and
that makes him a little cross. He then usually demands more
devotion and grandiose material stuff (like airplanes) from his
followers to help fortify his ego that he really is somebody
important. I think Guru Maharaj Ji's behavior fits that scenario
perfectly.
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Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 11:22:23 (EDT)
Poster: free Email: To: JW Subject: Re: no wonder you ran hot! Message: In addition to complaining about this burdensome life, and all of us slaves,like he said in 95 or 96 at a coordinaters conference in LA : volunteers suck. Of course the person who told me that, who was there, felt guilty because she could think of reasons why it applied to her. In montreal recently he complained about the knowledge. He said feeling the breath with appreciation was like trying to climb mt. everest. This was told to me today by the same person. I had to ask about that very topic to have her come up with it because she also believes that and doesn't try. It is not like that! If you view your own life as work, and a virtually impossible chore, you will never realize the natural ease that is available. The constant friend that is the lifesaver as well as the life itself. The finger to hold onto in the sometimes very bumpy lives we live. The feeling that is there to have instead of being vulnerable to all the dark kind of stuff always available inside. Like frustration,anger,greed,envy,lust(obsessing on desire), and whatever else qualifies. Mainly all the stuff we complain about m having. How is he going to come out of it if the one ticket out is viewed as he views it? I officially give up on him now. The disaster about his mother was not quite enough to do it for him. It did him a lot of good, but life still eludes him. I am no longer going to be a fountain of m related stuff because he obviously is in for another big fall and I dont need to feel like he is getting away with anything. There is a force that has its ways and he is not out of its reach. So fine, maybe this time I can successfully disengage. I guess I can befriend the god power now that I've complained about the god related show enough. Hello life! let the others think you are a mountain climb away. Putting aside darkness and laziness, there you are! Feeling my lifevest, I float on your motion and live my time. Feeling the heaven while being in the heaven, that makes sense. Thanks for the lift. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Fri, Jul 11, 1997 at 21:33:03 (EDT)
Poster: Scott Email: To: Tom Subject: Re: no wonder you ran hot! Message: Beautifully put! - Scott
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 21:48:00 (EDT)
Poster: Scott Email: sperry2@miraclevision.com To: Everyone Subject: FAQ for move Message: Finally got the FAQ finished. Hope it answers one or two questions. It's at: F.A.Q.. Scott
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 08:39:37 (EDT)
Poster: Scott Email: sperry2@miraclevision.com To: Everyone Subject: Archive #13 and Usenet move. Message: - Yes, it was time to archive again. With the recently unacceptably slow speed of the forum, this should help. - Also, one Netscape 'trick' that I have found quite useful to speed up reading the forum when it gets this slow... (I don't know if any other browsers have this ability, but as you may already know, Netscape is the browser of choice for over 85% of all web surfers.) - When accessing a message from the main forum page, don't do the normal mouse-click routine: that is, don't simply 'left-click' on the message link to open it up. Instead, 'right-click' on it and then type the letter 'N' for 'open link in New window. When you are ready to back to the list of links on the forum, you can simply click on the 'X' box in the upper right corner. That will close the 'forum-message-box' and you should then see the main forum page there instantly, without having to wait for it to reload. A great savings in time. -
As for the planned move to Usenet. If all goes well, we should
be over there before the ticker at the bottom of this page
expires. (Within 7 days.)
- I should be done with the archive in the next hour or so, I'll put up a notice when it's ready. Scott
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 09:42:49 (EDT)
Poster: Archive now ready Email: To: All Subject: Re: Archive #13 and Usenet move. Message: Archive #13 is now ready. I'm working on the FAQ for the move. Scott
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Date: Tues, Jul 8, 1997 at 23:57:48 (EDT)
Poster: They're creepy and Email: To: Indian fog lovers Subject: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: What a wonderful place india is. The safe place for the lord to maniifest for thousands of years. Many incarnations of god, generation after generation of lucky indians having the benefit of his repeated presence. Holy places everywhere, Temples dedicated to god's many fun filled incarnations and various forms. Some temples are dedicated to the time he came as Ganesh the half elephant-half man. I wonder where the line was drawn, above the waist? slightly below the waist? Oh that god and his madcap ways! Temples dedicated to Hanuman the ultimate devotee. Too bad he was a monkey! And with all those humans around! What kind of message is that to the human devotees? Temples dedicated to snakes. Snakes everwhere in the temple and requireing your devotion. Temples dedicated to rats. Rats everywhere and hey! bring your food offering . And something for the priest. But best of all, thousands of years of the
lord manifesting there has left thier culture in a really divine
state.
Naturally, the
rawat family is brahmin.
At the festival, I am dancing with a
couple of 'sisters'
I guess you cant expect someone coming from that
environment to be the one to save the world from the worst fog of
all, the fog of illusion that we are not all totally equal.
So the track record is really overwhelming that
this is the way god likes it. Maharaji is classic
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 00:53:59 (EDT)
Poster: 45 Email: To: july ninth Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: Hooray for the feeling that is independent of all the factors! I was just brought to a dancing mood and I dedicated it to JW. And in the face of life and the face of death, I can feel a joy. I think Rumi was the dancing fool. OP sent me an e-mail of a poem? by rumi, it goes like this. I am drunk and you are insane, who is going to save the world? Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 00:58:19 (EDT)
Poster: op Email: To: bb Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: Don't do me any favors. I dropped the Ji's a long time ago. Remember that M dropped the Ji family a long time ago too. Also remember that they dropped him for marrying a "servant" (for those uninitiated in the Indian tradition, M's mother had NOT been initiated when she married Shri Hans - it would not be seemly in the Indian way for a devotee to marry the master. She could become a devotee [read servant] only AFTER she was already his mistress.) As far as using 'Ji' as a suffix of respect, that can be done whenever you want to. For anyone. But what has been gnawing at me all evening is exactly what you write about - the differences. The separation. As long as you feel the separation, there is the illusion of great differences. (apologies to Deena, who likes her new, fast car) I can't get into the differences. What M taught me, continues to teach me, is that there is no separation. Only in Peter Pan does the shadow become unstuck and have to be sewn back on. In all other universes, the shadow is part and parcel of the being, unless there's no light and thus no shadow. Am I being esoteric, Jim? Analogies are part of my thought process. They grow in me like weeds. There I go again. Part of the beauty of it all is that M IS growing - not always the way we would choose him to - he may not say the words the way you wish he would (>Hey! I don't direct the show!< you say) As for me, I'm still amazed. Amazed because there grows in me a sense of wonder and of love that I can't explain away, because every day another miracle jumps out at me from behind its most recent hiding place. And amazed because there you are (collectively), not seeing it and I'm not blaming you, but I wonder (in another sense) why you can't - or won't. The only thing that hits me with a heavy wallop are the deaths some of you speak about. As for lost youth - I spent a lot of mine in a Lower East Side / California / Europe treck that included everything from homelessness to psychedelics to opiates. I could spend my life regretting THAT. But I have this ingrained motherspeak that keeps shouting back to my consciousness: 'Don't Cry Over Spilled Milk!' - and so I don't. And then - I know a lot of people who have died. All walks of life, all reasons. It hurts that people let themselves be dragged down so much they chose to exit life, no matter what the circumstance - ashram, cancer, bad driving skills, poor love connections. If I dwell on that, I'll live my life depressed, and it won't have anything to do with M or knowledge that I spend my life in that state. My overblown 'superego' - to get freudian about it - wants to fix it all. Not only for the ones who died, but for all of those who mourn for them. And their families. I have no solution for this, and I doubt M does either, on an emotional level. So perhaps I am 'shelf-ish' - I choose to live linked to a consciousness that transcends the separation from the body. I can feel a very intense suffering for those who reached an impasse in life they couldn't cross (I HAVE come close to it myself) - but I can't allow myself to get wrapped up in their web. And also I have experienced M in states of extreme compassion. Doing for others what I've never seen ANYONE else do. I still insist that not one of us - and now I'm not putting up a wall you/I; I really mean not one of us - can see the total picture. Tom, Rumi was neither angry nor disappointed when he spoke to his master. He was stating the absurdity of logic when referring to the ways of the material world. What are we
trying to rule over, anyway?
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 01:06:05 (EDT)
Poster: op Email: To: 45 Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: so we're still crossing consciousness. we wrote about the rumi quote at the same time - HUH? Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 01:39:00 (EDT)
Poster: 45 Email: To: op Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: Are you going to Amaroo? You should go. It will be really be a slice of heaven if you are in the right perspective. Why not? I would do it now but in a different way. But I would have my fun and ignore the stuff that is no longer for me. I still like that water thing. I love dancing with anybody and I could use a break from the kids. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |
Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 02:22:00 (EDT)
Poster: op Email: To: 45 Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: Maybe I should change my name every 20 seconds or so, too. Certainly keeps people on their toes - a good way to be if you want them to dance. I told you, you're on my lottery list. But that's the only way I'm going to get there too - unless one of those other miracles bounces off the wall at me. It just might. One just bounced me straight to Miami. I really don't even worry about being in the right perspective. Forcing my consciousness to conform to something that it might or might not be is not my idea of sat-chit-anand. The path is arduous only because it consists of an eternal series of letting-go. Do you really think he'll do that 'water thing' in Amaroo? I love dancing with the wind.
Really.
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 02:26:33 (EDT)
Poster: op Email: To: b45b Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: You weren't one of the rainbow gypsies, were you? Probably not, if you came around in 73, but you might have joined them later... (why 45?) This will probably be my last post until
post-Miami. I wish you all a wonderful and fruitful and powerful
week.
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 03:11:16 (EDT)
Poster: bb ji Email: To: op ji Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: Well that is a hoot about the timing, you are typing and I am dancing and we both talk about the rumi piece. I was going to respond to specific
points you said, then I thought I would read your post a few
times and then just wing it. So here goes.
I think that is his
clearest work.
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Date: Wed, Jul 9, 1997 at 03:20:25 (EDT)
Poster: bb ji Email: To: op Subject: Re: they're kooky, the brahmin family! Message: I wasn't a rainbow gypsy. They picked their name on an acid trip I bet. Actually gypsys are complete thieves and cheats. May they be born again as religious fanatics and spend thier entire lives in some god forsaken devotional practice. arti, mantras, prayers to --well, does it matter? Letters to santa go to someone, but not santa. Back To Index -:- Top of Index |